Posted on request: ivory,silver & twistcore!

[Maurice]

Yes I know your vision about it David. Thanks for responding.
It seems that more people share your vision (according the many emails I receive about this piece).

The first thing that came in my mind when I saw this piece was that it could be from Borneo.
I didn't mention it here on the forum to see if more people came up with it.
I only did mention that to another forumite in a privat email and to the friend I got it from when I gave my first comment on it.
Yesterday I got an email from another friendcollector who said in an email that it could be Borneo (no, not dayak ;-) )?

Nobody has more suggestions or philosophies on this one?
I can't hardly believe it!

[ThePepperSkull]

just curious: Where in Indonesia did they produce sundang? This is a very interesting revelation, as I thought aside from Mindanao/sulu/borneo, the only other regions who produced them would be peninsular malaysia.

[Battara]

Well there are/were Moros or Moro influence in Sabah, Borneo.

[David]

Yes Maurice, i am also surprised that there aren't more opinions on this piece. Just for comparison look at the reprousse work on the sheath of this sundang which some have also identified as Malay. To my eyes i see a similar floral design that seems quite unlike Moro okir.
You can see the rest of this sword here:
http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=11708

[Maurice]

Originally Posted by David

Yes Maurice, i am also surprised that there aren't more opinions on this piece. Just for comparison look at the reprousse work on the sheath of this sundang which some have also identified as Malay. To my eyes i see a similar floral design that seems quite unlike Moro okir.
You can see the rest of this sword here:
http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=11708

Thanks for the link David.
I have seen it but had forgotten about it to check the floral design.
I indeed can see also some similarities, wo I know what you mean.
The one in the link is also a very nice and special one, with less reactions..

[Maurice]

Originally Posted by ThePepperSkull

just curious: Where in Indonesia did they produce sundang? This is a very interesting revelation, as I thought aside from Mindanao/sulu/borneo, the only other regions who produced them would be peninsular malaysia.

That is a good question, anyone can answer this one specific and tell us where to find/read it?
I know that you can add Celebes to your enumeration according van Zonneveld.

[Mytribalworld]

Hi,

I don't think you'll find an answer for that. Don't forget that there was a lot of trade so its more likely that Moro blades and Malay blades where traded to Borneo dressed up in Borneo than that they where forgued locally.
All Borneo sunadangs I could find are most of Philippine and Malay origin.
If your keris is from Borneo than I think its somewhere from the direction in or around Brunei.

[David]

Originally Posted by Maurice

That is a good question, anyone can answer this one specific and tell us where to find/read it?
I know that you can add Celebes to your enumeration according van Zonneveld.

Many source cite Sulawesi/Celebes as the actual origin of the Sundang in general. Even if this is incorrect i think it is fair to say that that it can be added to the Peninsula as at least one place of origin for non-Moro Sundangs.

[Gustav]

Here an older thread about something inbetween kris and sepokal bugis: http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=3804

[Maurice]

Digging this old thread up, because I might have new information about the origin of the sundang.
According to an European keris collector, who lived several years in the kelantan state of Malaysia, the sundang originates from south Thailand / North east Malaysia.
According to him it looks like Lankasuka, regarding the blade, ganja and also the silverwork on the sleeve.

As I have no knowledge about the region we are talking here, I hope some of you know more and could confirm or discuss it?

Thank you in advance,
Maurice

[Amuk Murugul]

Originally Posted by Maurice

Digging this old thread up, because I might have new information about the origin of the sundang.
According to an European keris collector, who lived several years in the kelantan state of Malaysia, the sundang originates from south Thailand / North east Malaysia.
According to him it looks like Lankasuka, regarding the blade, ganja and also the silverwork on the sleeve.

As I have no knowledge about the region we are talking here, I hope some of you know more and could confirm or discuss it?

Thank you in advance,
Maurice

Hullo everybody!

My doea-benggol's worth .....

If you want to know about keris culture around the southern Thailand area, you may wish to contact Hj. Ismail Benjasmith or Abang Awang. I'm sure Malay forumites will be able to guide you there.

Best,