Sumatran Mystery?

[David]

This is a strange one. Well, it's a bit of a mystery to me anyway. I have never seen either this dhapur or hilt form before. I don't post the blades of my collection very often, but this one has me stumped and i am curious what the consensus will be. I am calling this a patrem for now as the blade length is only 9 inches, but other than that i am pretty clueless. The hilt is what appears to be very old ivory with black horn at the base. The form seems to fall somewhere between the Javanese planar form and that of the Jawa Demam hilts. There is also black horn at the toe of the sheath stem that helps tie the dress ensemble together. The brass hilt cup is the only thing that seems perhaps a bit off about the flow of the dress. The sheath was obviously made for the blade as the fit is superb with the blade riding purposely high in a style i see more on peninsula keris.
The blade is short and stout.a very sturdy little fellow. There is no visible pamor, but that might change if stained. I think someone was perhaps a bit too aggressive cleaning this once as there are some scratch marks left behind. The blade, as you can see is very narrow at the waist and very leaf like. It appears to have a second gandik of a sort at back of the blade and what, in my imagination at least, is possibly intended to represent a putut, a seated, praying figure. None of the carving of the features appears very expert, but there is an over all feeling of quality about this short, but stout blade.
Any thoughts on this one? I would love to see other blades with a similar dhapur or another hilt with a similar form.

[kai]

Hello David,

Thanks for posting yours! Seems it's oddball season...

This is a strange one. Well, it's a bit of a mystery to me anyway. I have never seen either this dhapur or hilt form before. I don't post the blades of my collection very often, but this one has me stumped and i am curious what the consensus will be. I am calling this a patrem for now as the blade length is only 9 inches, but other than that i am pretty clueless.
<snip>
The blade is short and stout.a very sturdy little fellow. There is no visible pamor, but that might change if stained. I think someone was perhaps a bit too aggressive cleaning this once as there are some scratch marks left behind. The blade, as you can see is very narrow at the waist and very leaf like. It appears to have a second gandik of a sort at back of the blade and what, in my imagination at least, is possibly intended to represent a putut, a seated, praying figure. None of the carving of the features appears very expert, but there is an over all feeling of quality about this short, but stout blade.

I'd certainly love to see this blade stained!

I believe this blade got crafted with the Bangkinang style in mind; regarding the small size, yours would be in the Bahari class rather than being a real patrem.

However, it's obvious that this blade doesn't follow the classic Bangkinang style and rather presents some exaggerated features. I'm attaching a bad pic of a 13 inch keris blade with similar features from a past auction - will try to get better ones. I am toying around with a (northern?) Malay peninsula origin for both blades - very tentative though!

The hilt is what appears to be very old ivory with black horn at the base. The form seems to fall somewhere between the Javanese planar form and that of the Jawa Demam hilts. There is also black horn at the toe of the sheath stem that helps tie the dress ensemble together. The brass hilt cup is the only thing that seems perhaps a bit off about the flow of the dress.

I can't help with the hilt - don't remember having seen anything similar either. Usually an added horn ring is a repair for a broken hilt; however from the ivory carving one might tend to believe this being original. Could you please post pics of the lower side of the hilt without pendokok and also a peek inside the pesi hole? Horn ring tightly attached?

The pendokok does look very crude and also the fit seems pretty dubious. A small one like in the other keris would look much better IMHO.

The sheath was obviously made for the blade as the fit is superb with the blade riding purposely high in a style i see more on peninsula keris.

Also not uncommon with some more southern keris. While not typical enough to be really sure, this scabbard may well be from northern Malaya though.

Regards,
Kai

[David]

Thanks Kai. I do indeed see the similarity in blade profiles, though with very different treatment to the backside of the blade (greneng et al).
I would have placed the sheath with a Palembang/South Sumatra attribution. Do you have any examples of sheaths from the northern end of the peninsula that have this form?
I shot these images some over a week ago. Since then we've had nothing but dark gray days here. As soon as i get some better light i will try to get those additional images of the hilt for you. I had considered the possibility that the horn could be a repair, though i also note that the figurative elements of the ivory portion (i.e. the feet) appear to be complete. Still doesn't discount repair, but gives me pause.
Given the time of year it will be a while before i might consider staining this blade if at all. I am curious if there is pamor though.

[GIO]

Hi David,
very interesting item. In my VERY HUMBLE opinion though this is a keris-like object. The manufacture is very crude and has no detail which can be attributed to a keris. I think that the blade has no pamor, but, before using warangan, you can easily check if you apply a mild acid (lemon juce or acetic acid) on the blade: a faint design of the pamor should appear.
Looking forward to see the result on the forum, I hope to read the opinions of other members more experienced than I.

[Jean]

Hi David,
I never saw a similar piece but offer my opinion as follows:
To me the blade seems to have been reshaped especially on the back side (wadidang), I can apparently see some traces of filing of the greneng and above it. It may have been shortened also and I doubt that it has pamor. As Kai showed a similar but apparently more original blade with a Malay/ East Sumatra JD hilt and full greneng, it may be a little-known local type of blade from Malaysia or East Sumatra.
The odd scabbard is reminiscent of the Palembang style without the "rudder" at the back but with a V shaped buntnut which is not used in South Sumatra.
The ivory hilt is old and of an unknown design & origin but the horn insert and crude pendokok seem recent.
So overall I would describe it as an assembly kris but not a KLO and I am open to other opinions especially from our Malaysian members...
Regards

[David]

Originally Posted by GIO

Hi David,
very interesting item. In my VERY HUMBLE opinion though this is a keris-like object. The manufacture is very crude and has no detail which can be attributed to a keris.

hmmm…well, i appreciate your response Gio, but personally believe that calling this a "keris-like-object" is perhaps taking it a bit far. No, this certainly isn't the work of an empu and does not seem to follow any known pakem. I have entertained the notion that perhaps this was created by a village smith without much previous experience in crafting keris who may have been working from memory without a clear example to copy from. I do realize that for some collectors anything that does not fall into a keraton pakem is not a legitimate keris, but from my perspective if it was created indigenously to serve the cultural purpose of a keris then it is a legitimate keris regardless of a lack of detailed excellence in execution. I tend to reserve the term "keris-like-object" for things like those nasty Bali tourist "keris" with the painted on pamors.
What is for certain is that somebody considered this keris important enough to spend the time and money to dress it well. I have no doubt that this sheath was created specifically for this blade.
Kai, i am attaching a shot up the hole of the hilt as you requested. To answer your question, the horn piece is indeed tightly attached to the ivory.

[David]

Originally Posted by Jean

Hi David,
I never saw a similar piece but offer my opinion as follows:
To me the blade seems to have been reshaped especially on the back side (wadidang), I can apparently see some traces of filing of the greneng and above it. It may have been shortened also and I doubt that it has pamor. As Kai showed a similar but apparently more original blade with a Malay/ East Sumatra JD hilt and full greneng, it may be a little-known local type of blade from Malaysia or East Sumatra.
The odd scabbard is reminiscent of the Palembang style without the "rudder" at the back but with a V shaped buntnut which is not used in South Sumatra.
The ivory hilt is old and of an unknown design & origin but the horn insert and crude pendokok seem recent.
So overall I would describe it as an assembly kris but not a KLO and I am open to other opinions especially from our Malaysian members...
Regards

Thanks for your response Jean. I don't think this has been reshaped, just not very well shaped in the first place (see my suggestion in my response to Gio). I think the file marks remain because the keris wasn't very well finished in the first place. I agree with both you and Gio that there is most probably no pamor in this keris.
I can't tell when the horn may have been added to the ivory hilt, though as Kai suggested it may be a means to continue the life of an old valued ivory hilt that became deteriorated at the base. The pendokok seems the most out of place part so i might be looking for suggestions on what to replace it with. Since this one seems hard to place geographically exactly what the pendokok should look like is difficult to determine.
To your knowledge is the "V" shaped buntut used in any part of Sumatra? I believe Kai suggested perhaps a peninsula origin.

[A. G. Maisey]

I'm with you David:- this is a genuine keris, but it has been produced outside the area of influence of a major cultural center.

Yes, many people hold the opinion that any keris that does not follow a defined pattern that has been set down either by tradition, or in an authorised guide-book (pakem) is outside the guidelines and thus not a keris.

To a degree, this is legitimate point of view, and it is reasonable to apply this standard to those keris which are of superior workmanship of a level that indicates production by a knowledgeable and skilled maker.

However, we often tend to forget that there were vast areas of S.E.Asia that were not under the direct influence of any cultural center, or center of power, and these areas were occupied by ordinary people --- subsistence farmers, fishermen, forest workers. If one of these people needed a keris to be made, they would most likely turn to the nearest smith. If there was no existing keris available for the smith to copy, he had to work from memory. The result is most often a simple keris of rather pedestrian workmanship.

A similar thing happened with dress:- in the palace environment, or urban setting, it was essential that a man's keris should be dressed in the correct fashion, however, in a village setting away from a major center, the rules were (and are) not nearly so strict. If it was necessary to produce a scabbard, or a hilt, the owner himself would often produce these himself. In fact, in days long past, the production of all weapon dress was most probably done by the owner as a display of his skill in carving, the male balance to the female skill of weaving.

Skilled craftsmen lived in towns and cities and were paid for their work, but these skilled craftsmen were not available to everybody.

[Jean]

Originally Posted by David

Thanks for your response Jean. I don't think this has been reshaped, just not very well shaped in the first place (see my suggestion in my response to Gio).
To your knowledge is the "V" shaped buntut used in any part of Sumatra? I believe Kai suggested perhaps a peninsula origin.

Hi David,
Your blade is only 9 inches long while the one shown by Kai is 13 inches long.
The horn buntut may not be original as it looks very shiny and not well proportioned IMO (too short). It may have been added at the same time as the one at the base of the hilt? Yes, some krisses Panjang attributed to Bangkinang include this V-shaped buntut (see Zonneveld page 64), however these krisses may actually originate from Malaysia...
You will also see some Sumatrese scabbards with V-shaped buntut in the Krisdisk from K.S Jensen in Chapter 9.3 (Krisses from Sumatra), but none in the Malaysia chapter.
Regards

[David]

Originally Posted by Jean

Your blade is only 9 inches long while the one shown by Kai is 13 inches long.

I'm not sure what you are trying to say here. Kai has suggested that this keris may have been intended to be a keris bahari. My understanding of those blades is that they are usually around 10 in. long. Kai's example is 13 in. which might be a little long for that form. Mine is a little short for that form (and why i first wondered if it was intended as a patrem. But if you are implying that my blade has been reshaped and shortened because Kai's example is 4 in. longer i would have to respectfully disagree. I see no evidence that this blade was ever any longer.

Originally Posted by Jean

The horn buntut may not be original as it looks very shiny and not well proportioned IMO (too short). It may have been added at the same time as the one at the base of the hilt? Yes, some krisses Panjang attributed to Bangkinang include this V-shaped buntut (see Zonneveld page 64), however these krisses may actually originate from Malaysia...
You will also see some Sumatrese scabbards with V-shaped buntut in the Krisdisk from K.S Jensen in Chapter 9.3 (Krisses from Sumatra), but none in the Malaysia chapter.

I suspect that the horn buntut was also original to this sheath. While it may be a bit too short in comparison to similar sheaths i believe that the wider stem necessary to accommodate this broader (for it's length) blade may have dictated that. Also, like this blade, not all sheaths are made in outland areas to the specifics of the court.

[Jussi M.]

For what it´s worth I actually really like the blade...

For some reason it strikes a chord in me. - Something very "Indian" about it.

Just a subjective opinion, that´s all.

J.

[David]

Originally Posted by Jussi M.

For what it´s worth I actually really like the blade...

For some reason it strikes a chord in me. - Something very "Indian" about it.

Just a subjective opinion, that´s all.

J.

Well Jussi, that's what i though too…

[wisnoewijaya79]

I've heard about "ANAK ALANG GULING" a rare keris from malay, is this the piece???

[David]

Originally Posted by wisnoewijaya79

I've heard about "ANAK ALANG GULING" a rare keris from malay, is this the piece???

Well i personally could not say. I did a quick search and most of what i saw under that name simply looked like anak alang keris to me so i am uncertain exactly what the "guling" delineates.

[A. G. Maisey]

That's a nice inventive term.

A guling is a "Dutch wife", or a bolster, like is used in a bed to put your leg up on, or to separate an unmarried couple.

The shape of this blade of yours David, is quite reminiscent of a guling.

I've never heard the term applied to a keris before, but there are a million or more keris terms out there I've never heard of.

[David]

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

I've never heard the term applied to a keris before, but there are a million or more keris terms out there I've never heard of.

Yes Alan, undoubtable so. If you google "anak alang guling" you will discover that it is terminology that is being used today, but i don't understand the reasoning for it since all the supposed example of it just look like keris anak alang to me. The "guling" part of the name seems superfluous.

[A. G. Maisey]

As I said David:- inventive.