Ruined bichaq/yataghan

Emanuel · 28th June 2007, 06:17 PM

Hello,
Here is a bichaq or yataghan blade that I got some time ago. It was heavily encrusted with rust to the extent that much of the metal in the tang had been corroded away. The bid was low and I thought what the heck, if I clean it up and restore it I'll have a nice yataghan for peanuts.
So far the cleaning went well, most of the rust is gone, although it could do with a few more dunks in lemon juice.
It is 16.5" long or 42cm, and the spine at the base is 8mm thick. What I like about the piece is that it has an integral bolster, a feature that so far I haven't seen on many yataghan.

In time I will carve some scales in walrus ivory or maybe oosik. I am undecided about how far I'll take the sanding to remove the pitting. I don't want to go too deep and end up with a really thin blade.
Any comments as to origin, or any thoughts are always appreciated.

Emanuel

TVV · 28th June 2007, 06:42 PM

I hate to pop in into every thread and identify things as Balkan, but I am afraid I will have to do it again, as it looks to me like this could be a blade from a karakulak, or shepherd's knife from the late 19th/eraly 20th century from, here I go again, the Balkans. These are characterized by shorter yataghan-like blades and simple, unadorned hilts and scabbards. They are still relatively cheap and easy to find, especially compared to yataghans, and it is easy for someone to buy such knives, strip them from their hilts and then offer only the blades on eBay as early Ottoman yataghans, or even Greek mahairas in some cases. Here is a picture of what it may have looked like:

As far as the restoration is concerned, I personally would not go as far as putting ivory scales, as horn ones would be sufficient and perhaps more accurate. Scabbards were made of two pieces of wood, covered in leather and held with a bracelet or two, nothing fancy.

Emanuel · 28th June 2007, 07:07 PM

Thank you very much Teodor! This doesn't sadden me one bit, and it's a good thing you told me about the handle material. Black horn will be easier to get. I am searching the archives for other discussion on these, but could you post a shot of the handle so I can do a decent restoration job?

Regards,
Emanuel

TVV · 28th June 2007, 07:13 PM

Manolo,

There is nothing to be saddened about, it is still a nice blade. The hilt scales should have small ears, but the decoration is very much a matter of your own taste. Here is a close-up of the hilt of the karakulak posted in my previous post, note the similarity with Bosnian bichaqs. That inlay will be difficult though:

You can go for something simple, such as this:

I will try to post more hilts later, when I am back home.

Regards,
Teodor

Emanuel · 28th June 2007, 07:27 PM

Excellent Teodor, thank you! The decoration is indeed similar to Bosnian bichaqs...Balkans as you said

I will start with the simple kind, in time I will try my hand at inlay.

Cheers,
Emanuel

katana · 28th June 2007, 08:00 PM

Hi Emanuel,
should be an interesting project, look forward to your updates.

kronckew · 28th June 2007, 08:22 PM

more hilt pics:

my karakulak yataghan, 22in blade, grips 5.5 in , including a 3/4in integral bolster:

overall (new scabbard made from tourist tulwar scabbard with reversed fittings)

ariel · 28th June 2007, 09:18 PM

The scabbard looks like the one from "Made in India" saber-type thingies, only turned upside down to accomodate the Yataghan blade.
Am I wrong?

kronckew · 29th June 2007, 12:55 AM

ariel, you are of course correct, as the yat didn't come with a scabbard i got the thing for a few pounds only cause the yat fit the things scabbard & i didn't feel like making one myself, i just reversed the fittings & shortened it a bit. it'll do till i get creative and make a proper one some day. i've got 2 more swords and a khukuri, a kard, and a zira bouk of in need of scabbards, i may be forced to get carving. (or find someone else who'll do it)

the metallic remains are hidden away in the store room, the blade was junk as was the brass hilt & will get tossed at some point as i can't figure out a good use for them......i could always sell it on ebay as an antique indian naval dirk without scabbard as seen on ''sharpe's challenge''

i will get around to it at some point, it may not be as original, but will be functional: here's one i made earlier, still needs a bit of metal work, but gives me something to carry the blade around in....(made of 1/8" boxwood, stained & varnished, needs a few brass bands i think...)

(the knife was sold as a "whaler's knife" as they thought the hilt looked like a whale's head..

it could have been an indonesian whaler i guess.)

Emanuel · 29th June 2007, 05:59 PM

Thanks for the pics, they'll help a lot. I'll update as the restoration progresses.

28th June 2007, 06:17 PM	#1
Emanuel Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 1,242	Ruined bichaq/yataghan Hello, Here is a bichaq or yataghan blade that I got some time ago. It was heavily encrusted with rust to the extent that much of the metal in the tang had been corroded away. The bid was low and I thought what the heck, if I clean it up and restore it I'll have a nice yataghan for peanuts. So far the cleaning went well, most of the rust is gone, although it could do with a few more dunks in lemon juice. It is 16.5" long or 42cm, and the spine at the base is 8mm thick. What I like about the piece is that it has an integral bolster, a feature that so far I haven't seen on many yataghan. In time I will carve some scales in walrus ivory or maybe oosik. I am undecided about how far I'll take the sanding to remove the pitting. I don't want to go too deep and end up with a really thin blade. Any comments as to origin, or any thoughts are always appreciated. Emanuel Attached Images

29th June 2007, 12:55 AM	#9
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,183	ariel, you are of course correct, as the yat didn't come with a scabbard i got the thing for a few pounds only cause the yat fit the things scabbard & i didn't feel like making one myself, i just reversed the fittings & shortened it a bit. it'll do till i get creative and make a proper one some day. i've got 2 more swords and a khukuri, a kard, and a zira bouk of in need of scabbards, i may be forced to get carving. (or find someone else who'll do it) the metallic remains are hidden away in the store room, the blade was junk as was the brass hilt & will get tossed at some point as i can't figure out a good use for them......i could always sell it on ebay as an antique indian naval dirk without scabbard as seen on ''sharpe's challenge'' i will get around to it at some point, it may not be as original, but will be functional: here's one i made earlier, still needs a bit of metal work, but gives me something to carry the blade around in....(made of 1/8" boxwood, stained & varnished, needs a few brass bands i think...) (the knife was sold as a "whaler's knife" as they thought the hilt looked like a whale's head.. it could have been an indonesian whaler i guess.) Last edited by kronckew; 29th June 2007 at 01:25 AM.

28th June 2007, 06:42 PM	#2
TVV Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Bay Area Posts: 1,621	I hate to pop in into every thread and identify things as Balkan, but I am afraid I will have to do it again, as it looks to me like this could be a blade from a karakulak, or shepherd's knife from the late 19th/eraly 20th century from, here I go again, the Balkans. These are characterized by shorter yataghan-like blades and simple, unadorned hilts and scabbards. They are still relatively cheap and easy to find, especially compared to yataghans, and it is easy for someone to buy such knives, strip them from their hilts and then offer only the blades on eBay as early Ottoman yataghans, or even Greek mahairas in some cases. Here is a picture of what it may have looked like: As far as the restoration is concerned, I personally would not go as far as putting ivory scales, as horn ones would be sufficient and perhaps more accurate. Scabbards were made of two pieces of wood, covered in leather and held with a bracelet or two, nothing fancy.

28th June 2007, 07:07 PM	#3
Emanuel Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 1,242	Thank you very much Teodor! This doesn't sadden me one bit, and it's a good thing you told me about the handle material. Black horn will be easier to get. I am searching the archives for other discussion on these, but could you post a shot of the handle so I can do a decent restoration job? Regards, Emanuel

28th June 2007, 07:13 PM	#4
TVV Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Bay Area Posts: 1,621	Manolo, There is nothing to be saddened about, it is still a nice blade. The hilt scales should have small ears, but the decoration is very much a matter of your own taste. Here is a close-up of the hilt of the karakulak posted in my previous post, note the similarity with Bosnian bichaqs. That inlay will be difficult though: You can go for something simple, such as this: I will try to post more hilts later, when I am back home. Regards, Teodor

28th June 2007, 07:27 PM	#5
Emanuel Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 1,242	Excellent Teodor, thank you! The decoration is indeed similar to Bosnian bichaqs...Balkans as you said I will start with the simple kind, in time I will try my hand at inlay. Cheers, Emanuel

28th June 2007, 08:00 PM	#6
katana Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Kent Posts: 2,653	Hi Emanuel, should be an interesting project, look forward to your updates.

28th June 2007, 08:22 PM	#7
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,183	more hilt pics: my karakulak yataghan, 22in blade, grips 5.5 in , including a 3/4in integral bolster: overall (new scabbard made from tourist tulwar scabbard with reversed fittings)

28th June 2007, 09:18 PM	#8
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	The scabbard looks like the one from "Made in India" saber-type thingies, only turned upside down to accomodate the Yataghan blade. Am I wrong?

29th June 2007, 05:59 PM	#10
Emanuel Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 1,242	Thanks for the pics, they'll help a lot. I'll update as the restoration progresses.