18th cent. Ottoman? dagger

erlikhan · 8th February 2005, 09:55 PM

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...tem=6506189151
may i learn your comments about this dagger on ebay? And anybody can read the inscription on it? i can read only date 1135 (around 1720 yrs)

regards

Battara · 9th February 2005, 11:53 PM

This is a court dagger and was originally sold on the Oriental-arms site. Here is the link the exact piece:

http://www.orieintal-arms.com/item.php?id=739

this should also provide some of the translation information for you.

Kamil · 10th February 2005, 12:47 AM

erlikhan,
It's difficult to read. The text doesn't seem to be in Arabic (two words possiblu end with "-si" then maybe Ottoman Turkish? I regret that I do not know this language - and there were times when a learned man spoke Arabic, Turkish and Persian...) I will try to decipher something more (but if Turkish, not to understand, but this is not a problem for you, I think)

erlikhan · 13th February 2005, 11:23 AM

Yes. No problem. Just convert it to latin alphabet please.

Kamil · 15th February 2005, 01:43 AM

OK. It looks like that (without vocalization, which is not written):
y-ni k-r-si (or: k-r-mi) ha-s-h-r-si (or:ha-m-h-r-si, or: ha-m-h-ri)
Just replace dashes with any vowels and that's it!
Please, let me know if this resembles any Turkish words (the first one could be yeni, but how it was written in Ottoman times?)
The style of writing can suggest that the text is not Persian, then maybe Turkish...

erlikhan · 15th February 2005, 02:10 AM

Thank you! It is Turkish. I guess, at least 60-70% sure of it, it says "yenikaresi hemsehrisi", which means "man from Yenikaresi". I know Karesi was a province name in that period, and Yenikaresi means "New Karesi", which I dont know where was located, or if still exists with this name.

Jeff D · 15th February 2005, 02:15 AM

Hi Erlikhan,

You might find this site useful in the future. http://www.omniglot.com/writing/turkish.htm

Jeff

erlikhan · 15th February 2005, 02:22 AM

Very interesting.Let me check if i manage it. Thank you Jeff.

8th February 2005, 09:55 PM	#1
erlikhan Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Istanbul Posts: 452	18th cent. Ottoman? dagger http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...tem=6506189151 may i learn your comments about this dagger on ebay? And anybody can read the inscription on it? i can read only date 1135 (around 1720 yrs) regards Last edited by erlikhan; 8th February 2005 at 11:11 PM.

9th February 2005, 11:53 PM	#2
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,229	This is a court dagger and was originally sold on the Oriental-arms site. Here is the link the exact piece: http://www.orieintal-arms.com/item.php?id=739 this should also provide some of the translation information for you.

10th February 2005, 12:47 AM	#3
Kamil Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Poland, Warsaw Posts: 33	erlikhan, It's difficult to read. The text doesn't seem to be in Arabic (two words possiblu end with "-si" then maybe Ottoman Turkish? I regret that I do not know this language - and there were times when a learned man spoke Arabic, Turkish and Persian...) I will try to decipher something more (but if Turkish, not to understand, but this is not a problem for you, I think)

13th February 2005, 11:23 AM	#4
erlikhan Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Istanbul Posts: 452	Yes. No problem. Just convert it to latin alphabet please.

15th February 2005, 01:43 AM	#5
Kamil Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Poland, Warsaw Posts: 33	OK. It looks like that (without vocalization, which is not written): y-ni k-r-si (or: k-r-mi) ha-s-h-r-si (or:ha-m-h-r-si, or: ha-m-h-ri) Just replace dashes with any vowels and that's it! Please, let me know if this resembles any Turkish words (the first one could be yeni, but how it was written in Ottoman times?) The style of writing can suggest that the text is not Persian, then maybe Turkish...

15th February 2005, 02:10 AM	#6
erlikhan Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Istanbul Posts: 452	Thank you! It is Turkish. I guess, at least 60-70% sure of it, it says "yenikaresi hemsehrisi", which means "man from Yenikaresi". I know Karesi was a province name in that period, and Yenikaresi means "New Karesi", which I dont know where was located, or if still exists with this name.

15th February 2005, 02:15 AM	#7
Jeff D Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: B.C. Canada Posts: 473	Hi Erlikhan, You might find this site useful in the future. http://www.omniglot.com/writing/turkish.htm Jeff

15th February 2005, 02:22 AM	#8
erlikhan Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Istanbul Posts: 452	Very interesting.Let me check if i manage it. Thank you Jeff.