Last buy of 2008

Freddy · 31st December 2008, 11:59 AM

Yesterday, I went to Brussels and found this piece on the Fleamarket : a Moro kris.

Don't know a lot about these weapons and I'm open to any suggestions. Probably has been repaired in the past. It has an interesting looking belt hook. Has anyone seen one before ?

The blade itself has 13 curves.

total length : 54 cm

Freddy · 31st December 2008, 12:03 PM

I think the sheath is original.

The top of the handle shows some damage.

VANDOO · 31st December 2008, 05:40 PM

A NICE KRIS PROBABLY MADE FROM WW1 TO WW2 AND USED THRU WW2, JUST A GUESS. THE HANDLE IS LIKELY THE ORIGINAL BUT HAS BEEN STRIPPED THE STRAPS AND METAL FITTINGS MAY HAVE BEEN SILVER AND SOLD OFF OR LEFT LAYING AROUND WHEN THE OWNER COULD NOT GET THE MOTHER OF PEARL POMMEL CAP OFF AND BROKE IT. YOU CAN SEE THE MARKS WHERE THE WOOD WAS CARVED AS WELL AS WHERE THE OLD WRAPPINGS WERE AND THE GROOVE AT THE TOP WAS LIKELY TO HAVE HAD A METAL BAND AND PROBABLY ALSO A METAL FERRULE AT THE FORTE TO HOLD THE BACA BACA STRAPS. THE GANJA IS SEPARATE ON THE BLADE AND THE BLADE MAY EVEN HAVE A PATTEREN IF ETCHED, NICE FIND!1

THE KRIS GUYS CAN PROBABLY GIVE YOU MORE AND BETTER INFO ON IT.
JOSE WOULD PROBABLY LIKE TO FIX IT UP PROPER

asomotif · 28th October 2009, 02:36 AM

Bumping this old thread.

Any comments on the scabbard fitting ?
It seems rather crude to me, but what kind of fittings would this type of scabbard have ?

Best regards,
Willem

Rick · 29th October 2009, 12:09 AM

One scabbard half has a carved protrusion at the top to hold it in the sash.

This metal clip is new school .

Pardon the rushed picture .

asomotif · 30th October 2009, 08:53 AM

Thanks Rick,

New school, as in "too new" ?
Or maybe even original to this scabbard ?

I found this example of a "clasp" by Federico.

Best regards,
Willem

kai · 30th October 2009, 11:13 AM

Hello Willem,

Quote:

New school, as in "too new" ?
Depends on your taste, I guess. The blade is not that old to begin with (around 1930, I'd guess) and the file work is also of a lesser quality.

Quote:

Or maybe even original to this scabbard ?

The scabbard could be original or as well be a later replacement. The belt hook does look fairly well made but it will probably difficult to establish wether it was original to the scabbard or even if it really is Moro...

Quote:

I found this example of a "clasp" by Federico.

That looks more like an inserted piece of wood which I've seen with a few scabbards made from quality hardwood. Maguindanao scabbards made from cheaper wood (especially rattan) usually have the notch carved from a single piece like in Rick's pic.

Regards,
Kai

kai · 30th October 2009, 11:25 AM

Hello Freddy,

Sorry, must have overlooked your original posting last year!

Looks like a fairly typical late but still genuine Maguindanao Lanti to me. The asang-asang made from copper wire and the grip binding may be replacements. It may be worth to replace both if you still need a winter project...

As discussed, the belt hook is atypical. I'd have no qualms to replace it with a band of woven rattan (if you do, also replace the lower rattan binding).

Regards,
Kai

asomotif · 30th October 2009, 10:24 PM

Thanks Kai for the interesting info and comments.

Quote:

It may be worth to replace both if you still need a winter project...

The project has already started (Freddy sold the kriss to me last year)

Sajen · 30th October 2009, 10:55 PM

Look good already!

ThePepperSkull · 4th January 2010, 06:55 PM

WOnderful! any updates on this project?

David · 4th January 2010, 09:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kai

That looks more like an inserted piece of wood which I've seen with a few scabbards made from quality hardwood. Maguindanao scabbards made from cheaper wood (especially rattan) usually have the notch carved from a single piece like in Rick's pic.

This kris has been in my collection for some time now. It is indeed an inserted piece of wood as Kai suggests, held in place by the silver bands.

asomotif · 4th January 2010, 11:48 PM

Quote:

any updates on this project?

The damaged mother of pearl cap is now replaced with a thin slice of ivory fixed with 2 silver nails.
I am up to the point where I should wrap the hilt with rope.
I am mentally preparing for that job

this might take some time.

ThePepperSkull · 1st August 2012, 10:53 AM

Any more updates? I'd love to see the end product! Also, who did this? It's wonderful, but looks different than Jose's work (who seems to draw inspiration from historical use of okir designs embossed into his silver fittings rather than the simpler lines embossed on the silver fittings put on this one.)

I am used to seeing Jose's metalwork used for restorations like this (and have had him do wonderful silverwork on a punto for a Barung of mine. Great work!). I do know that Philip Tom does restorations on Moro pieces, but have only seen his carving work as opposed to any metal fittings done by him. Maybe it was done by someone else? I am very curious!

I'm also resurrecting this thread in hopes of getting ideas for a similar hilt for a newly-made maguindanao blade I have and want rehilted. I'd like one of those flat-pommeled grips like these ones. Did these ever have Horn caps or were they mostly Ivory and Mother Of Pearl?

Here's some pictures for inspiration/reference that I'm using

Any suggestions?

31st December 2008, 11:59 AM	#1
Freddy Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Sint-Amandsberg (near Ghent, Belgium) Posts: 830	Last buy of 2008 Yesterday, I went to Brussels and found this piece on the Fleamarket : a Moro kris. Don't know a lot about these weapons and I'm open to any suggestions. Probably has been repaired in the past. It has an interesting looking belt hook. Has anyone seen one before ? The blade itself has 13 curves. total length : 54 cm

31st December 2008, 12:03 PM	#2
Freddy Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Sint-Amandsberg (near Ghent, Belgium) Posts: 830	more pics I think the sheath is original. The top of the handle shows some damage.

28th October 2009, 02:36 AM	#4
asomotif Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 2,225	Belt hook on moro scabbard Bumping this old thread. Any comments on the scabbard fitting ? It seems rather crude to me, but what kind of fittings would this type of scabbard have ? Best regards, Willem

29th October 2009, 12:09 AM	#5
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,294	One scabbard half has a carved protrusion at the top to hold it in the sash. This metal clip is new school . Pardon the rushed picture . Attached Images Last edited by Rick; 29th October 2009 at 12:19 AM.

30th October 2009, 08:53 AM	#6
asomotif Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 2,225	MORO KRIS scabbard question Thanks Rick, New school, as in "too new" ? Or maybe even original to this scabbard ? I found this example of a "clasp" by Federico. Best regards, Willem Attached Images Last edited by asomotif; 30th October 2009 at 09:16 AM.

31st December 2008, 05:40 PM	#3
VANDOO (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: OKLAHOMA, USA Posts: 3,138	A NICE KRIS PROBABLY MADE FROM WW1 TO WW2 AND USED THRU WW2, JUST A GUESS. THE HANDLE IS LIKELY THE ORIGINAL BUT HAS BEEN STRIPPED THE STRAPS AND METAL FITTINGS MAY HAVE BEEN SILVER AND SOLD OFF OR LEFT LAYING AROUND WHEN THE OWNER COULD NOT GET THE MOTHER OF PEARL POMMEL CAP OFF AND BROKE IT. YOU CAN SEE THE MARKS WHERE THE WOOD WAS CARVED AS WELL AS WHERE THE OLD WRAPPINGS WERE AND THE GROOVE AT THE TOP WAS LIKELY TO HAVE HAD A METAL BAND AND PROBABLY ALSO A METAL FERRULE AT THE FORTE TO HOLD THE BACA BACA STRAPS. THE GANJA IS SEPARATE ON THE BLADE AND THE BLADE MAY EVEN HAVE A PATTEREN IF ETCHED, NICE FIND!1 THE KRIS GUYS CAN PROBABLY GIVE YOU MORE AND BETTER INFO ON IT. JOSE WOULD PROBABLY LIKE TO FIX IT UP PROPER

30th October 2009, 11:25 AM	#8
kai Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 3,254	Hello Freddy, Sorry, must have overlooked your original posting last year! Looks like a fairly typical late but still genuine Maguindanao Lanti to me. The asang-asang made from copper wire and the grip binding may be replacements. It may be worth to replace both if you still need a winter project... As discussed, the belt hook is atypical. I'd have no qualms to replace it with a band of woven rattan (if you do, also replace the lower rattan binding). Regards, Kai

30th October 2009, 10:55 PM	#10
Sajen Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Germany, Dortmund Posts: 8,797	Look good already!

4th January 2010, 06:55 PM	#11
ThePepperSkull Member Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 338	WOnderful! any updates on this project?

1st August 2012, 10:53 AM	#14
ThePepperSkull Member Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 338	Any more updates? I'd love to see the end product! Also, who did this? It's wonderful, but looks different than Jose's work (who seems to draw inspiration from historical use of okir designs embossed into his silver fittings rather than the simpler lines embossed on the silver fittings put on this one.) I am used to seeing Jose's metalwork used for restorations like this (and have had him do wonderful silverwork on a punto for a Barung of mine. Great work!). I do know that Philip Tom does restorations on Moro pieces, but have only seen his carving work as opposed to any metal fittings done by him. Maybe it was done by someone else? I am very curious! I'm also resurrecting this thread in hopes of getting ideas for a similar hilt for a newly-made maguindanao blade I have and want rehilted. I'd like one of those flat-pommeled grips like these ones. Did these ever have Horn caps or were they mostly Ivory and Mother Of Pearl? Here's some pictures for inspiration/reference that I'm using Any suggestions? Attached Images Last edited by ThePepperSkull; 1st August 2012 at 11:03 AM.