More Moro(?) spears....

CharlesS · 25th March 2012, 01:02 AM

I was able to pick these up last weekend at the Baltimore show and both were in horrendous condition when I got them, so I have enjoyed working on them on and off this week, and here are the results. I really wish i had done these as "before and after" pics, just so you could see how much work went into them!

I presume the larger one is Moro for sure....It is about 8ft. overall, with a blade of 19in., so it is massive! The blade has a patten welded core that was evident even its original state.

The second one is presumely Moro as well, but MUCH less sure. The spear is about 7ft. overall, and blade is leaf shaped and 13in. long, with a chieselled out panel in the middle. The curious thing is the banded ferrule of some white metal alloy. Please note the figures in each panel, all different in each panel, but two are more recognisable figures. Both figures appear to have Japanese/Chinese motifs and characteristics to me...one, looks like a lady in robes, the other, a dragon(?).

This strikes me as very odd for a Moro spear. I know the Moros were not Muslim purists, and that there were other influences in their form of Islam, but these figures seems strange by any Filipino standard, much less the Moro, who via Islam, should not have looked affectionately at figures in art, and certainly not human figures, and even less likely, women!

I am anxious to hear feedback and comments on this one in particular.

I feel certain these are all from Moroland as they were with a 'veteran' lot of 6 spears, five of them no doubt Moro, but this one just didn't quite seem to fit in for the reasons mentioned above.

Spunjer · 25th March 2012, 04:36 AM

Or Chinese motifs... Understand that there were pockets of chines
e population in Mindanao and Sulu. I vote Moro, bro...

Nathaniel · 25th March 2012, 06:03 AM

Fantastic pieces Charles! Thanks for showing us the fruits of your labor. They look great! I think the it looks Chinese as well. Hardly a place in Asia you can go and not find Chinese communities!

Robert · 25th March 2012, 09:20 AM

These are both great looking spears Charles and you have also done a very nice job of cleaning and restoration on them. I too especially like the one with the smaller blade and the engraved alloy collar. Can you tell if is it a silver alloy or not? Could you also post a picture of the complete spears? These would be a great addition to anyones collection, my congratulations to you on being able to acquire them for yours.

Robert

CharlesS · 25th March 2012, 02:36 PM

Thanks guys.

Robert, the length of these makes a full pic very difficult.

Sajen · 25th March 2012, 03:02 PM

Hello Charles,

beautiful spears. Although I am not an expert I think that both are Moro, the way it look let me think like this.
Me too forget many times to take pictures before restauration jobs! olleyes:

Regards,

Detlef

CharlesS · 27th March 2012, 04:02 AM

Thanks for the input guys!

nacho · 27th March 2012, 04:17 AM

Hi Charles,

A similar moro spear was sold by Ashoka Arts last year. It also has the incised decoration using Chinese motif, on silver. This one has a twistcore blade. I have always wondered about this one, even at one point questioned whether it is moro (am now more convinced it is moro).

Edwin

Nonoy Tan · 27th March 2012, 05:46 AM

I have seen these kind of spears (i.e. with Chinese motifs and/or characters) in some residences located on the eastern coast of Palawan, facing the Sulu Sea. Some areas there are predominantly Muslim. Also the influence of the Chinese in these parts of Sulu have been very strong, in the past as well as the present.

CharlesS · 27th March 2012, 05:53 PM

Nacho,

Very interesting spear, and had someone asked be about it without having any clue torwards its actual attribution, I would be very pulled between Moro and Sumatran....Sumatran primarily because of the way the haft is worked.

Very interesting piece!

nacho · 27th March 2012, 06:46 PM

This was posted by Lee, Nov 16, 2010. Similarly with incised decoration on silver. This one also has a twistcore blade.

Battara · 27th March 2012, 11:41 PM

What about Chinese Moros? There were some who had Chinese in their blood, and I heard of one even becoming a datu..........

harimauhk · 28th March 2012, 04:17 AM

The Chinese have definitely long been in and out of the Philippines: I was recently down in Basilan and Zamboanga, a stone's throw from Sulu, and there were Chinese businesses everywhere, even with the very real threat of shootouts and bombings. There has long been Chinese influence in the region. There was some very nice Chinese trade pottery on display at the museums in Sabah, Borneo too.

Battara · 28th March 2012, 03:38 PM

Thank you Harimauhk, my point exactly.

nacho · 28th March 2012, 04:20 PM

Speaking of Chinese in Sulu, the current governor of Sulu is Abdusakur Tan. I guess the "Tan" surname indicates he has Chinese lineage.

kino · 14th June 2015, 06:27 PM

It's not exactly plural. Adding to CharlesS complement of Chinese influenced Moro spears is this example. Described as a civilian Chinese spear, is an oddly shaped budiak. The spear head is ~12 in., from the tip to bottom of ferrule 22 in.
In my interpretation the etchings on the ferrule suggests that spring is in the air.

CharlesS · 14th June 2015, 10:43 PM

Kino,

One of the strangest and most interesting spears I have seen. Could you please post a pic of the spear head together with the ferrule and a small part of the haft??? I am curious what the overall look is.

Certainly looks like Moro forging, but I would never have guessed it from the blade shape, which looks very Chinese or SE Asian.

kino · 15th June 2015, 02:28 AM

The total length of the spear is 69 inches.

Battara · 15th June 2015, 02:44 AM

What a weird and unique piece! Never seen its like before Kino, thanks for posting it.

CharlesS · 15th June 2015, 06:48 PM

It's a "strange bird", but looks completely right together, and not a put together thing.

I love it!

25th March 2012, 01:02 AM	#1
CharlesS Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Greenville, NC Posts: 1,857	More Moro(?) spears.... I was able to pick these up last weekend at the Baltimore show and both were in horrendous condition when I got them, so I have enjoyed working on them on and off this week, and here are the results. I really wish i had done these as "before and after" pics, just so you could see how much work went into them! I presume the larger one is Moro for sure....It is about 8ft. overall, with a blade of 19in., so it is massive! The blade has a patten welded core that was evident even its original state. The second one is presumely Moro as well, but MUCH less sure. The spear is about 7ft. overall, and blade is leaf shaped and 13in. long, with a chieselled out panel in the middle. The curious thing is the banded ferrule of some white metal alloy. Please note the figures in each panel, all different in each panel, but two are more recognisable figures. Both figures appear to have Japanese/Chinese motifs and characteristics to me...one, looks like a lady in robes, the other, a dragon(?). This strikes me as very odd for a Moro spear. I know the Moros were not Muslim purists, and that there were other influences in their form of Islam, but these figures seems strange by any Filipino standard, much less the Moro, who via Islam, should not have looked affectionately at figures in art, and certainly not human figures, and even less likely, women! I am anxious to hear feedback and comments on this one in particular. I feel certain these are all from Moroland as they were with a 'veteran' lot of 6 spears, five of them no doubt Moro, but this one just didn't quite seem to fit in for the reasons mentioned above. Attached Images Last edited by CharlesS; 25th March 2012 at 02:36 PM.

25th March 2012, 06:03 AM	#3
Nathaniel Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 865	Fantastic pieces Charles! Thanks for showing us the fruits of your labor. They look great! I think the it looks Chinese as well. Hardly a place in Asia you can go and not find Chinese communities! Last edited by Nathaniel; 25th March 2012 at 06:14 AM.

27th March 2012, 04:17 AM	#8
nacho Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Makati Posts: 69	Hi Charles, A similar moro spear was sold by Ashoka Arts last year. It also has the incised decoration using Chinese motif, on silver. This one has a twistcore blade. I have always wondered about this one, even at one point questioned whether it is moro (am now more convinced it is moro). Edwin Attached Images

27th March 2012, 06:46 PM	#11
nacho Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Makati Posts: 69	This was posted by Lee, Nov 16, 2010. Similarly with incised decoration on silver. This one also has a twistcore blade. Attached Images

14th June 2015, 06:27 PM	#16
kino Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,003	Birds and the bees It's not exactly plural. Adding to CharlesS complement of Chinese influenced Moro spears is this example. Described as a civilian Chinese spear, is an oddly shaped budiak. The spear head is ~12 in., from the tip to bottom of ferrule 22 in. In my interpretation the etchings on the ferrule suggests that spring is in the air. Attached Images

25th March 2012, 04:36 AM	#2
Spunjer Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Witness Protection Program Posts: 1,730	Or Chinese motifs... Understand that there were pockets of chines e population in Mindanao and Sulu. I vote Moro, bro...

25th March 2012, 09:20 AM	#4
Robert EAAF Staff Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Centerville, Kansas Posts: 2,196	These are both great looking spears Charles and you have also done a very nice job of cleaning and restoration on them. I too especially like the one with the smaller blade and the engraved alloy collar. Can you tell if is it a silver alloy or not? Could you also post a picture of the complete spears? These would be a great addition to anyones collection, my congratulations to you on being able to acquire them for yours. Robert

25th March 2012, 02:36 PM	#5
CharlesS Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Greenville, NC Posts: 1,857	Thanks guys. Robert, the length of these makes a full pic very difficult.

25th March 2012, 03:02 PM	#6
Sajen Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Germany, Dortmund Posts: 8,786	Hello Charles, beautiful spears. Although I am not an expert I think that both are Moro, the way it look let me think like this. Me too forget many times to take pictures before restauration jobs! olleyes: Regards, Detlef

27th March 2012, 04:02 AM	#7
CharlesS Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Greenville, NC Posts: 1,857	Thanks for the input guys!

27th March 2012, 05:46 AM	#9
Nonoy Tan Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 293	I have seen these kind of spears (i.e. with Chinese motifs and/or characters) in some residences located on the eastern coast of Palawan, facing the Sulu Sea. Some areas there are predominantly Muslim. Also the influence of the Chinese in these parts of Sulu have been very strong, in the past as well as the present.

27th March 2012, 05:53 PM	#10
CharlesS Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Greenville, NC Posts: 1,857	Nacho, Very interesting spear, and had someone asked be about it without having any clue torwards its actual attribution, I would be very pulled between Moro and Sumatran....Sumatran primarily because of the way the haft is worked. Very interesting piece!

27th March 2012, 11:41 PM	#12
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,226	What about Chinese Moros? There were some who had Chinese in their blood, and I heard of one even becoming a datu..........

28th March 2012, 04:17 AM	#13
harimauhk Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 88	The Chinese have definitely long been in and out of the Philippines: I was recently down in Basilan and Zamboanga, a stone's throw from Sulu, and there were Chinese businesses everywhere, even with the very real threat of shootouts and bombings. There has long been Chinese influence in the region. There was some very nice Chinese trade pottery on display at the museums in Sabah, Borneo too.

28th March 2012, 03:38 PM	#14
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,226	Thank you Harimauhk, my point exactly.

28th March 2012, 04:20 PM	#15
nacho Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Makati Posts: 69	Speaking of Chinese in Sulu, the current governor of Sulu is Abdusakur Tan. I guess the "Tan" surname indicates he has Chinese lineage.

14th June 2015, 10:43 PM	#17
CharlesS Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Greenville, NC Posts: 1,857	Kino, One of the strangest and most interesting spears I have seen. Could you please post a pic of the spear head together with the ferrule and a small part of the haft??? I am curious what the overall look is. Certainly looks like Moro forging, but I would never have guessed it from the blade shape, which looks very Chinese or SE Asian.

15th June 2015, 02:28 AM	#18
kino Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,003	The total length of the spear is 69 inches. Attached Images

15th June 2015, 02:44 AM	#19
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,226	What a weird and unique piece! Never seen its like before Kino, thanks for posting it.

15th June 2015, 06:48 PM	#20
CharlesS Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Greenville, NC Posts: 1,857	It's a "strange bird", but looks completely right together, and not a put together thing. I love it!