Trench Knife or Hunting Knife??

[ericlaude]

Hello,
I found this knife in a lot of 5 knife that I bought . I think it's French but I'm not sure, someone can help me about what is it?
The handle is made of horn, The added pommel is engraved with initials (JC). The blade with four sides is very sharp. The brass scabbard has the same form as the blade .
Ovll Length 11 "(27.5)
Blade 6 "(15 cm)
Thanks in advance

[ericlaude]

2 others photos

[thinreadline]

when I first saw this I thought the handle was from an old carving knife and the blade was from a French Lebel bayonet ... however the difficulty in curving the the normally straight Lebel blade is one thing, but making a scabbard of the correct profile to fit it is quite another order of difficulty , so I am thinking was this made from scratch rather than made up of pre existing adapted parts. It seems over elaborate as a trench knife .

[Lew]

Definately French probably a hunting dagger or one used for self protection .

[hbhansen]

This could be a hunting dagger, for use on injured deer. You stick it in the hole, in the back of the skull, to kill the deer. Maybe it has got 4 sides, so that it will not break when the deer moves.
I carry a knife myself for the same purpose, when hunting deer...
Best regards
Henrik

[thinreadline]

I can see this being used as a personal weapon , but most hunting weapons are traditionally edged weapons proper . Granted this could be used for administering the coup de grace to a wounded quarry , but not for skinning , gralloching or jointing ... in which case yet another knife would have had to have been carried .

[hbhansen]

Originally Posted by thinreadline

I can see this being used as a personal weapon , but most hunting weapons are traditionally edged weapons proper . Granted this could be used for administering the coup de grace to a wounded quarry , but not for skinning , gralloching or jointing ... in which case yet another knife would have had to have been carried .

You're right about that. I personally carry another ekstra knife for skinning etc.

[thinreadline]

Originally Posted by hbhansen

This could be a hunting dagger, for use on injured deer. You stick it in the hole, in the back of the skull, to kill the deer. Maybe it has got 4 sides, so that it will not break if the deer moves.
I carry a knife myself for the same purpose, when hunting deer...
Best regards
Henrik

Yes this design gives rigidity & strength but with lightness compared to the standard stiletto . Yet it is not commonly encountered , maybe as it is more difficult to make . It is seen in some 20th century bayonets .. eg the French Lebel of WW1 & the British 1st pattern 'spike' bayonet for the No 4 Lee Enfield of WW2 ( see pics ) .

[hbhansen]

One more thought: Stilettos/bayonets and other blades made for stabbing another human has normally got a straight blade. I think the curved blade of this one would be quite good for the " coup de grace ". It's actually a difficult thing to do, but I'm quite shure the curved blade would help...

[kronckew]

i've seen something like this before, can't remember where, but it had a fancy cross guard on it, this one seems to be missing it at the blade/stag junction. i vaguely remember scandinavian, but maybe not.

[thinreadline]

Originally Posted by kronckew

i've seen something like this before, can't remember where, but it had a fancy cross guard on it, this one seems to be missing it at the blade/stag junction. i vaguely remember scandinavian, but maybe not.

Yes there is definitely something missing .... when I saw the pale band of staghorn this is what reminded me of those carving knives with staghorn handles in which there is always a silver ferrule just before the blade . I attach some pics of a 'bowie' of mine which is in fact just an old cut down carving knife with a Liverpool retailers name on it .... even the cross guard has cowsfeet finials and a boars head central motif !

[broadaxe]

I believe it is a "marriage". The blade & sheath appear to be of high quality, possibly French naval dirk of mameluke style, while the handle is too large and of German hunting knife style - check the conical recess for the absent ferrule/guard.

[thinreadline]

Originally Posted by broadaxe

I believe it is a "marriage". The blade & sheath appear to be of high quality, possibly French naval dirk of mameluke style, while the handle is too large and of German hunting knife style - check the conical recess for the absent ferrule/guard.

Yes I would agree with you that this is as you say a 'marriage' , the grip is definitely either an old carver or a German hunting knife 1900 - 1930 . The ferrule is missing and would have been of a similar type as seen in the attached German hunter pics or on my pictures of the large carver shown earlier.

[thinreadline]

Originally Posted by thinreadline

Yes I would agree with you that this is as you say a 'marriage' , the grip is definitely either an old carver or a German hunting knife 1900 - 1930 . The ferrule is missing and would have been of a similar type as seen in the attached German hunter pics or on my pictures of the large carver shown earlier.

Better still have just dug out a German hunting dagger of early 20th C with a conical ferrule .

[broadaxe]

Indeed. Just one thing - these knives are always posted as "hunting" while they are better suited for fighting. They were extremely popular with German troops circa WWI as private purchase.

[thinreadline]

Originally Posted by broadaxe

Indeed. Just one thing - these knives are always posted as "hunting" while they are better suited for fighting. They were extremely popular with German troops circa WWI as private purchase.

Agreed .. I suppose they equate to the US Bowie knife & the late Victorian / Edwardian British big game hunter / explorer's knife, ie an all purpose fighting, hunting, utility & survival tool