Unknown club for comment

kronckew · 12th April 2015, 05:29 PM

found this on e-pray, no one else bid. looks like a paddle club
that got bit by a shark

28 in.(71.1 cm.) LOA. couldn't find
anything similar here or on line. the pommel end looks familiar
but i can't place it. some small damage at the tip, looks like it
was stored tip down. baldric could have been added anytime.
last owner used it to hang the club. no other details till it arrives...

any ideas?

thanks in advance for your comments...

Tim Simmons · 12th April 2015, 05:48 PM

I was watching that. I am not sure what to make of it. I hope I might be able to come back with some info latter. It does look rather like a dance club but it does appear to be reasonably heavy as a weapon. I think the fact that it does not reflect age and hand use on the shaft, plus the blunting on the distal end that perhaps it is a dance club/wand. To me it looks like Oceanic work which is a horrible way to say things but we have no better, except South Pacific which could include the Antarctic.

kronckew · 12th April 2015, 07:17 PM

speculation rife on the penguin wars of antarctica pre contact. sadly the penguins civilization crumbled and they were found in a pre-stone-age society.
their only possessions from the past, a few clubs their legends say were carved by the gods.

anyway, here's a few more pictures: it does sort of look like there may have been a braided fibre binding on the grip in the past...

spiral · 12th April 2015, 09:51 PM

Not my field, but when I saw it something in the back of my head said Solomon islands...

Must have seen something that echo's that in book or hand at some time...

kronckew · 13th April 2015, 09:45 AM

that was my initial thought so i looked thru vanadoo's series of 'most desired oceanic clubs' series here w/o any luck. did a search on 'solomon' also w/o any success, tho some clubs has a similar pointy end, but stepped where it turned into the grip. i also wondered if it might be amazonian. no luck searching on that either. i'll think of it as 'solomon islands' for the moment.

(or as my antartic penguin club)

Maurice · 13th April 2015, 07:23 PM

The butt end and oval shaped shaft are carved the same as the paddle shaped war clubs from the Solomon islands.

kronckew · 13th April 2015, 08:32 PM

ah, well, solomon islands seems most likely then. i wonder how the penguins got one.

maybe another rennel islander? two attributed to rennell islands:

Maurice · 13th April 2015, 08:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kronckew

ah, well, solomon islands seems most likely then. i wonder how the penguins got one.

maybe another rennel islander?

I only noticed the shaft and butt reminds me of Solomon island clubs, but I don't know if it is one.

spiral · 13th April 2015, 08:36 PM

Sounds like were all on the same page eg. Solomon islands..

Kronckew Could the mostly sapwood side of a paddle club have been damaged & then later re shaped to how it looks now?

Of course we must never forget the current Seal/Penguin Antarctic wars..

Rape, genocide & the eating of the enemy victims...

linky

Maurice · 13th April 2015, 08:43 PM

[QUOTE=spiral]

Kronckew Could the mostly sapwood side of a paddle club have been damaged & then later re shaped to how it looks now?
[QUOTE]

I think that this could be likely the case, that it was paddle shaped before the damage, and recarved like this.

fearn · 16th April 2015, 04:38 AM

Sure that it's not student work from Hawai'i? I've seen some interesting modern art pieces in the stores around there selling native artwork. I asked, and while it's made for tourists, it is locally made by native Hawaiians. It's from high school woodworking classes, and they're trying to break into the art scene and make a few bucks.

F

kronckew · 16th April 2015, 09:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spiral

...

Of course we must never forget the current Seal/Penguin Antarctic wars..

Rape, genocide & the eating of the enemy victims...

linky

horrible. war at it's worst. surely that violates the geneva conventions?

what becomes of the children of such encounters? the children always suffer worst.

p.s. - the reporters did not do their homework. true seals do not have ears & do not 'walk' on their front flippers. sea lions have ears and use their long front flippers for locomotion and holding victims...

i blame the media anti-seal bias. i'm complaining to greenpeace and amnesty international.

Tim Simmons · 16th April 2015, 04:26 PM

I cannot see this as an altered paddle. It appears too thick to be a paddle blade and the shaping is too far off a central axis to have been originally a paddle. Measurements and object comparison would be helpful.

spiral · 16th April 2015, 11:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kronckew

sea lions use their long front flippers for locomotion and holding victims...

I blame the media anti-seal bias. i'm complaining to greenpeace and amnesty international.

I could see that...

Personally I think you need to ring prince Charlie & Edward. {using English euphemisms not Yankee ones..

}

Spiral

kronckew · 20th April 2015, 07:00 PM

aha! - club has arrived.

LOA 28 inches / 71 cm. width of blade roughly 4 in. thickness at blade approx. 1 in. weight 430 grams, just under a pound. tip not as damaged as it looks. sharp edges. definitely a club. it looks OLD, many greasy hand have held this and it looks like it's not been cleaned ever. rough polished surface with smoothed over tool marks under the patina. the two circular spots that i thoght may have been holes are not. they are the stubs of nails, one each side, that have been cut off or broken off and smoothed over. the (dirty) string baldric has sailor's knots, a bowline on the blade and two half hitches with an overhand stopper knot on the bitter end.

we seem to be getting a flood of clubs from the rennel islands recently.

spiral · 20th April 2015, 09:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kronckew

aha! - club has arrived.

LOA 28 inches / 71 cm. width of blade roughly 4 in. thickness at blade approx. 1 in. weight 430 grams, just under a pound. tip not as damaged as it looks. sharp edges. definitely a club. it looks OLD, many greasy hand have held this and it looks like it's not been cleaned ever. rough polished surface with smoothed over tool marks under the patina. the two circular spots that i thoght may have been holes are not. they are the stubs of nails, one each side, that have been cut off or broken off and smoothed over. the (dirty) string baldric has sailor's knots, a bowline on the blade and two half hitches with an overhand stopper knot on the bitter end.

we seem to be getting a flood of clubs from the rennel islands recently.

Stubs of nails... fascinating Kronckew, Clearly second use of the timber then.

This morning, while walking the dog I picked up some larch driftwood on the beach with copper roves in it, & some oak with bronze clench fast nails, both clearly from old ship timbers...

A couple of weeks ago there was some oak & elm with iron handmade nails in it as well. {I throw it all in a friends firewood pile on the way home..

}

What metal are the nails/whatever made from in the club?

kronckew · 20th April 2015, 09:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spiral

...
What metal are the nails/whatever made from in the club?

they're perfectly round, about 2mm across, what i can see is shiny black, so likely rust blued steel. no sign of red rust or verdigris. some of the black has leeched into the surrounding wood.

p.s. - the bronze nails could have been from one of claudius caesar's galleys heading for/from porchester castle

you should retrieve them from the fire ot & sell them as such on a certain auction site we are familiar with. or used to hold the copper bottom on the mary rose. a fortune awaits ye.

spiral · 21st April 2015, 07:16 PM

mmmmmm

Quote:

Originally Posted by kronckew

p.s. - the bronze nails could have been from one of claudius caesar's galleys heading for/from porchester castle

you should retrieve them from the fire ot & sell them as such on a certain auction site we are familiar with. or used to hold the copper bottom on the mary rose. a fortune awaits ye.

That nearly happens I must admit..

Well the copper & bronze goes in a scrap bag , but the iron ones looked very old, & will be hammered straight & added to the box of other interesting old & ancient wrought iron fittings & nails for the day they come in use...{Some have before.} I am sure some are very old & rare! All handmade for country mansion construction or ships.

I wonder if there an old nail forum?

But if there is I could turn up with my box of treasures & either be invited in to sit by the fire with the good old boys to discuss my treasures, or be rejected to a corner for bringing such common tat or even god forbid looked at askew for bringing a rarer higher quality piece better than there pride & joy example along, for show & tell !

kronckew · 21st April 2015, 07:52 PM

there are a few nail fora. sadly a bunch of wimmen discussing their claw polish.

there is a texas date nail collector's association, for dated railroad nails.

don't see much for UK nails.

spiral · 21st April 2015, 08:06 PM

I just found the same on the same searches!

Google will spot the market for such websites maybe?

Does no one else collect old nails?

Some of them are amazing!

Id be ok if I collected house bricks or barbed wire... thieve got their society's, forums, websites & collectors...

Actually I do have got one nice rare decorative housebreak, but it holds a drain cover in place to stop leaves blocking the drains at my mothers... I doubt if they'd be impressed with that... Practical though..

But the nails, where's the nail researcher's & experts?

12th April 2015, 05:29 PM	#1
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,178	Unknown club for comment found this on e-pray, no one else bid. looks like a paddle club that got bit by a shark 28 in.(71.1 cm.) LOA. couldn't find anything similar here or on line. the pommel end looks familiar but i can't place it. some small damage at the tip, looks like it was stored tip down. baldric could have been added anytime. last owner used it to hang the club. no other details till it arrives... any ideas? thanks in advance for your comments... Attached Images

12th April 2015, 07:17 PM	#3
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,178	speculation rife on the penguin wars of antarctica pre contact. sadly the penguins civilization crumbled and they were found in a pre-stone-age society. their only possessions from the past, a few clubs their legends say were carved by the gods. anyway, here's a few more pictures: it does sort of look like there may have been a braided fibre binding on the grip in the past... Attached Images

13th April 2015, 08:32 PM	#7
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,178	ah, well, solomon islands seems most likely then. i wonder how the penguins got one. maybe another rennel islander? two attributed to rennell islands: Attached Images Last edited by kronckew; 13th April 2015 at 08:50 PM.

12th April 2015, 05:48 PM	#2
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,806	I was watching that. I am not sure what to make of it. I hope I might be able to come back with some info latter. It does look rather like a dance club but it does appear to be reasonably heavy as a weapon. I think the fact that it does not reflect age and hand use on the shaft, plus the blunting on the distal end that perhaps it is a dance club/wand. To me it looks like Oceanic work which is a horrible way to say things but we have no better, except South Pacific which could include the Antarctic.

12th April 2015, 09:51 PM	#4
spiral Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,712	Not my field, but when I saw it something in the back of my head said Solomon islands... Must have seen something that echo's that in book or hand at some time...

13th April 2015, 09:45 AM	#5
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,178	that was my initial thought so i looked thru vanadoo's series of 'most desired oceanic clubs' series here w/o any luck. did a search on 'solomon' also w/o any success, tho some clubs has a similar pointy end, but stepped where it turned into the grip. i also wondered if it might be amazonian. no luck searching on that either. i'll think of it as 'solomon islands' for the moment. (or as my antartic penguin club)

13th April 2015, 07:23 PM	#6
Maurice Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 1,330	The butt end and oval shaped shaft are carved the same as the paddle shaped war clubs from the Solomon islands.

13th April 2015, 08:36 PM	#9
spiral Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,712	Sounds like were all on the same page eg. Solomon islands.. Kronckew Could the mostly sapwood side of a paddle club have been damaged & then later re shaped to how it looks now? Of course we must never forget the current Seal/Penguin Antarctic wars.. Rape, genocide & the eating of the enemy victims... linky

13th April 2015, 08:43 PM	#10
Maurice Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 1,330	[QUOTE=spiral] Kronckew Could the mostly sapwood side of a paddle club have been damaged & then later re shaped to how it looks now? [QUOTE] I think that this could be likely the case, that it was paddle shaped before the damage, and recarved like this.

16th April 2015, 04:38 AM	#11
fearn Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,247	Sure that it's not student work from Hawai'i? I've seen some interesting modern art pieces in the stores around there selling native artwork. I asked, and while it's made for tourists, it is locally made by native Hawaiians. It's from high school woodworking classes, and they're trying to break into the art scene and make a few bucks. F

16th April 2015, 04:26 PM	#13
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,806	I cannot see this as an altered paddle. It appears too thick to be a paddle blade and the shaping is too far off a central axis to have been originally a paddle. Measurements and object comparison would be helpful.

20th April 2015, 07:00 PM	#15
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,178	aha! - club has arrived. LOA 28 inches / 71 cm. width of blade roughly 4 in. thickness at blade approx. 1 in. weight 430 grams, just under a pound. tip not as damaged as it looks. sharp edges. definitely a club. it looks OLD, many greasy hand have held this and it looks like it's not been cleaned ever. rough polished surface with smoothed over tool marks under the patina. the two circular spots that i thoght may have been holes are not. they are the stubs of nails, one each side, that have been cut off or broken off and smoothed over. the (dirty) string baldric has sailor's knots, a bowline on the blade and two half hitches with an overhand stopper knot on the bitter end. we seem to be getting a flood of clubs from the rennel islands recently.

21st April 2015, 07:52 PM	#19
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,178	there are a few nail fora. sadly a bunch of wimmen discussing their claw polish. there is a texas date nail collector's association, for dated railroad nails. don't see much for UK nails.

21st April 2015, 08:06 PM	#20
spiral Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,712	I just found the same on the same searches! Google will spot the market for such websites maybe? Does no one else collect old nails? Some of them are amazing! Id be ok if I collected house bricks or barbed wire... thieve got their society's, forums, websites & collectors... Actually I do have got one nice rare decorative housebreak, but it holds a drain cover in place to stop leaves blocking the drains at my mothers... I doubt if they'd be impressed with that... Practical though.. But the nails, where's the nail researcher's & experts?