Insure or forget?

harrywagner · 3rd December 2015, 07:49 PM

I would like to solicit comments and opinions about these two Indian Bischwa. I am trying to decide if they should be insured or forgotten. I grew a thicker skin over the Thanksgiving holiday so please feel free to blast away. TIA.

Harry

VANDOO · 3rd December 2015, 08:32 PM

IF YOUR COLLECTION IS INSURED I WOULD INCLUDE THESE WITH THE REST OF THE COLLECTION FOR AT LEAST WHAT YOU HAVE IN THEM. OR GET THEM APPRAISED AND INSURE THEM FOR THAT VALUE UNLESS ITS LESS THAN YOU PAYED

GOOD LUCK THEY LOOK NICE TO ME BUT I AM JUST A OLD COLLECTOR AND FAR FROM AN EXPERT.

Battara · 3rd December 2015, 09:50 PM

I agree with Barry 200% (if that's possible). Speaking as one who had some of his collection stolen 2 years ago (

) I'd insure everything. Fortunately, I did........

harrywagner · 3rd December 2015, 09:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VANDOO

IF YOUR COLLECTION IS INSURED I WOULD INCLUDE THESE WITH THE REST OF THE COLLECTION FOR AT LEAST WHAT YOU HAVE IN THEM. OR GET THEM APPRAISED AND INSURE THEM FOR THAT VALUE UNLESS ITS LESS THAN YOU PAYED

GOOD LUCK THEY LOOK NICE TO ME BUT I AM JUST A OLD COLLECTOR AND FAR FROM AN EXPERT.

Thanks Vandoo. I like these. I just don't trust my judgement.

I did have them appraised, but I don't trust the appraisal either. Without getting into specifics (I am on thin ice here with regards to the forum rules) they were both valued at a price I thought much too high. I think my trust is better placed here with other collectors such as yourself. Thanks again for the input. Much appreciated.

estcrh · 3rd December 2015, 10:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by harrywagner

I would like to solicit comments and opinions about these two Indian Bischwa. I am trying to decide if they should be insured or forgotten. I grew a thicker skin over the Thanksgiving holiday so please feel free to blast away. TIA.

Harry

Harry, a closer look at the metal might be helpful. As for a thick skin, I would be embarassed to show here a few of the "mistakes" I have made over the years, mostly due to taking chances with bad images online and or bad descriptions, it is much easier to decide when seeing an item up close in person.

harrywagner · 4th December 2015, 01:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by estcrh

Harry, a closer look at the metal might be helpful. As for a thick skin, I would be embarassed to show here a few of the "mistakes" I have made over the years, mostly due to taking chances with bad images online and or bad descriptions, it is much easier to decide when seeing an item up close in person.

Many thanks Estcrh. Hopefully these will help.

estcrh · 4th December 2015, 06:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by harrywagner

Many thanks Estcrh. Hopefully these will help.

Harry, your pictures are good, I like the style of both of these, much nicer than many I have seen lately. The steel used looks like a modern pattern, I would have to say that both items are modern, based on what I have seen as far as steel coming from India lately. Hopefully you will get some more comments.

harrywagner · 4th December 2015, 12:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by estcrh

Harry, your pictures are good, I like the style of both of these, much nicer than many I have seen lately. The steel used looks like a modern pattern, I would have to say that both items are modern, based on what I have seen as far as steel coming from India lately. Hopefully you will get some more comments.

Many thanks! No doubt you are right about their being modern. If they were as old as they look it would have been the find of the century, and not even the Wagner luck is that good. I like them too much to display on my "wall of shame", so I will take Battara's advise and add them to the "to be insured" pile, but for an amount that I can trust is close to their actual value. Thanks again for your help. Much appreciated.

Harry

mross · 5th December 2015, 05:51 PM

I would insure, better safe than sorry. As long as you have documented evidence from an appraiser that is the value if anything happens. Appraised value does not mean sale price, jewelry is routinely appraised higher than sale price. However the appraised value is a starting point when negotiating a settlement, I would rather start higher than lower.

DaveA · 6th December 2015, 10:45 PM

Harry's question gives rise to a few of my own, but they are far more basic:

For insurance purposes, what is considered an authoritative appraisal?

What are the required qualifications of the appraiser?

Finally, how does one find such an appraiser (USA)?

Thanks.

Dave A.

kahnjar1 · 7th December 2015, 03:17 AM

[QUOTE=DaveA]Harry's question gives rise to a few of my own, but they are far more basic:

For insurance purposes, what is considered an authoritative appraisal?

What are the required qualifications of the appraiser?

Finally, how does one find such an appraiser (USA)?

Thanks.

Dave A.[/QUOTE
Hi Dave,]
I guess the answer to the above might lie with your Insurance Company. Terms of insurance differ between companies. If for instance your Policy would categorize your collection as "Household Goods" and ask only that items over a certain value be individually nominated, then your initial costs, and premiums will be a lot less than having to have ALL of your items valued, and nominated on your Policy. In this case you would only have to PROVE you possessed each item if a claim was necessary. A list of items and a photo of each should be all that is needed, but you would need to consult your Insurance Company or Broker, to establish what is required. They should also be able to point you in the right direction for an accepted Appraiser if one was necessary.
If however you have to have each piece valued, and pay a premium on your policy to insure them, then it may be better to leave them uninsured unless of course there is a particular item of high value. Depends a lot on what it you want to pay I guess.
Stu

ALEX · 7th December 2015, 11:03 AM

Just a few comments to what Stu mentioned. Be aware that "Household Goods" category will likely use depreciation clause. so if it comes to a claim, you get a fraction back. Most insurance companies use this for art categories as well. Make sure the coverage amount is stated in the policy as amount to be paid in the event of loss, with no depreciation, and items are covered at a full stated value. Most companies will ask for receipts, but some will not and do not require appraisals at all and will insure at fixed level for each item. as always, make sure to read fine print)

kahnjar1 · 7th December 2015, 06:45 PM

The point that Alex makes about depreciation is well founded as indeed some Insurance Companies DO have this clause.
Some, including the one I use here in NZ, have the option of a "Full replacement" cover, with individual cover required for items over a certain value. This of course costs a little more, but nothing like the additional charge for individual cover of items.
As mentioned above, you would need to talk to your own Insurer/Broker to establish which is the best option for you.
Stu

3rd December 2015, 07:49 PM	#1
harrywagner Member Join Date: Jul 2015 Posts: 373	Insure or forget? I would like to solicit comments and opinions about these two Indian Bischwa. I am trying to decide if they should be insured or forgotten. I grew a thicker skin over the Thanksgiving holiday so please feel free to blast away. TIA. Harry Attached Images

6th December 2015, 10:45 PM	#10
DaveA Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Wisconsin, USA Posts: 413	Appraisal for insurance purposes Harry's question gives rise to a few of my own, but they are far more basic: For insurance purposes, what is considered an authoritative appraisal? What are the required qualifications of the appraiser? Finally, how does one find such an appraiser (USA)? Thanks. Dave A.

3rd December 2015, 08:32 PM	#2
VANDOO (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: OKLAHOMA, USA Posts: 3,138	IF YOUR COLLECTION IS INSURED I WOULD INCLUDE THESE WITH THE REST OF THE COLLECTION FOR AT LEAST WHAT YOU HAVE IN THEM. OR GET THEM APPRAISED AND INSURE THEM FOR THAT VALUE UNLESS ITS LESS THAN YOU PAYED GOOD LUCK THEY LOOK NICE TO ME BUT I AM JUST A OLD COLLECTOR AND FAR FROM AN EXPERT.

3rd December 2015, 09:50 PM	#3
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,219	I agree with Barry 200% (if that's possible). Speaking as one who had some of his collection stolen 2 years ago ( ) I'd insure everything. Fortunately, I did........

5th December 2015, 05:51 PM	#9
mross Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 478	I would insure, better safe than sorry. As long as you have documented evidence from an appraiser that is the value if anything happens. Appraised value does not mean sale price, jewelry is routinely appraised higher than sale price. However the appraised value is a starting point when negotiating a settlement, I would rather start higher than lower.

7th December 2015, 03:17 AM	#11
kahnjar1 Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: CHRISTCHURCH NEW ZEALAND Posts: 2,739	[QUOTE=DaveA]Harry's question gives rise to a few of my own, but they are far more basic: For insurance purposes, what is considered an authoritative appraisal? What are the required qualifications of the appraiser? Finally, how does one find such an appraiser (USA)? Thanks. Dave A.[/QUOTE Hi Dave,] I guess the answer to the above might lie with your Insurance Company. Terms of insurance differ between companies. If for instance your Policy would categorize your collection as "Household Goods" and ask only that items over a certain value be individually nominated, then your initial costs, and premiums will be a lot less than having to have ALL of your items valued, and nominated on your Policy. In this case you would only have to PROVE you possessed each item if a claim was necessary. A list of items and a photo of each should be all that is needed, but you would need to consult your Insurance Company or Broker, to establish what is required. They should also be able to point you in the right direction for an accepted Appraiser if one was necessary. If however you have to have each piece valued, and pay a premium on your policy to insure them, then it may be better to leave them uninsured unless of course there is a particular item of high value. Depends a lot on what it you want to pay I guess. Stu

7th December 2015, 11:03 AM	#12
ALEX Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 936	Just a few comments to what Stu mentioned. Be aware that "Household Goods" category will likely use depreciation clause. so if it comes to a claim, you get a fraction back. Most insurance companies use this for art categories as well. Make sure the coverage amount is stated in the policy as amount to be paid in the event of loss, with no depreciation, and items are covered at a full stated value. Most companies will ask for receipts, but some will not and do not require appraisals at all and will insure at fixed level for each item. as always, make sure to read fine print)

7th December 2015, 06:45 PM	#13
kahnjar1 Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: CHRISTCHURCH NEW ZEALAND Posts: 2,739	The point that Alex makes about depreciation is well founded as indeed some Insurance Companies DO have this clause. Some, including the one I use here in NZ, have the option of a "Full replacement" cover, with individual cover required for items over a certain value. This of course costs a little more, but nothing like the additional charge for individual cover of items. As mentioned above, you would need to talk to your own Insurer/Broker to establish which is the best option for you. Stu