Basket hilted swords

[Cathey]

Hi guys

My first love has always been the basket hilted sword. I do not post very often as I have little spare time working hard to pay for my collecting habit. However, between Jim McDougall and my husband’s insistence I thought I should make more of an effort. I would like to start a thread devoted to Basket hilted swords. Note I have not said Scottish as there is a fine line between the Scottish and British basket, often it is difficult to say with any certainly which is which. I have attempted to start a thread on this subject ton other forums however there has been little interest, so here goes.

I currently have 20 Basket hilted swords in my ranging in age from mid 16th century to the end of the reign of Queen Victoria, which is supposed to be my cut off date.

Reference material, from my library:
SWORDS AND SWORD MAKERS OF ENGLAND AND SCOTLAND, BEZDEK, Richard H. Not bad general reference.
SCOTTISH WEAPONS & FORTIFICATIONS 1100-1800, CALDWELL, David H. (again general)
HIGHLAND DRESS, ARMS AND ORNAMENT, CAMPBELL, Lord Archibald
SCOTTISH SWORDS FROM THE BATTLEFIELD AT CULLODEN, CAMPBELL, Lord Archibald
Scottish Arms and Armour (Shire Collections) (Paperback) by Fergus Cannan (more a history book)
SWORDS FOR THE HIGHLAND REGIMENTS 1757 – 1784, DARLING, Anthony D.
WEAPONS OF THE HIGHLAND REGIMENTS Historical Arms Series No.33, DARLING, Anthony D.
Ancient scottish Weapons a series of ddrawings by the late james drummond
THE SCOTTISH DIRK Historical Arms Series No 26 Paperback Second Printing 1993 Museum Restoration Service, FORMAN, James D.
BRITISH BASKET-HILTED SWORDS: A TYPOLOGY OF BASKET-TYPE SWORD HILTS, MAZANSKY (C.) (Probably the best reference book to come on the market).
BATTLE WEAPONS OF THE AMERICAN REVOLUTION, NEUMANN, George G. (excellent general reference to early British Swords)
EUROPEAN WEAPONS AND ARMOUR From the Renaissance to the Industrial Revolution. OAKESHOTT, Ewart
SCOTTISH SWORDS AND DIRKS an illustrated reference guide to Scottish Edged Weapons, WALLACE, John
SCOTTISH ARMS MAKERS. A biographical dictionary of makers of firearms, edged weapons and armour working in Scotland from the 15th Century to 1870, WHITELAW, Charles E.
Scottish Sword 1600-1945: An Illustrated History (Paperback), WITHERS, Harvey J.S. (great pictures)
THE SWORDS AND THE SORROWS. An exhibition to commemorate the Jacobite rising of 1745 and the battle of Culloden 1746.

If any one can recommend anything not on this list let us know.

A friend of ours the Baron of Earlshall is writing what will be the definitive work on early basket hilted swords. It will be several large volumes and stop at the end of the 1700 hundreds (18th Century).

Now for a basket hilt to start this thread:

Date Circa 1540 - 1560 (16th-17th Century)
Nationality British
Over Length Overall 36 ¼ “(87.6 cm)
Blade length blade 32” (81.6 cm)
Hilt widest point The hilt is 6 ¼ “(16 cm).

Description BASKET HILT British backsword. Three segments of the guard (each comprised of three vertical bars) are linked by two small junction plates. The upper tips insert into the large, hollow Spherical pommel. The holes into which they insert have been enlarged to allow restoration of the grip and tang button. The grip is a replacement as is the tang. The thin single edged blade is contemporary with the hilt.

General Remarks
This sword was also used by Scots in the English Civil War. A similar example was excavated on the site of Basing House which was destroyed in 1645 and another recovered from under the Mary Rose in 1545.

The Baron of Earshall has requested pictures of this sword for his book and believes it to be English c.1540-50.

[laEspadaAncha]

Hi Cathey,

Nice sword, and great thread!

I swear your thread gives me a sense of deja vu - if the date you had joined wasn't this last October, I'd be certain I had seen this thread a couple years ago. Anyway, as I had just today tracked down a couple pictures of my own to send to someone here, I'll happily share my own (and lone!) example:

Scottish Basket Hilted Broadsword
Marked to 42nd Regiment of Foot (Black Watch)
Date: ca. 1790-1800
OAL: (approx.) 38 1/2 inches
Blade length: (approx.) inches 32 3/8

[Cathey]

Hi LaEspadaAncha

Very nice sword, I have not seen a pattern sword actually marked to the 42nd before. Now you have me thinking abaout the black watch I will post the first of three that I have.

Date Circa 1750-70 (18th Century)
Nationality Scottish Black Watch 42nd Highland Regiment

English basket-hilted backsword A Scottish military basket hilted backsword issued to the 42nd Highlanders, circa 1750-1770, older straight single edged fullered blade marked FARARA. Regulation hilt, panels pierced with triangular and circular openings. Truncated conical pommel (marked with an ?) with special button, wire bound leather grip.

If anyone can work out what is on the pommel I would be very grateful. I think they are numbers.

Cheers Cathey

[celtan]

Beautiful sword. I know there are a couple Black Watch swords around here, captured in 1797. I believe one is in Government hands, and out of reach for mere mortals, but I think I might have seen it once. There might be another in private hands, I'll check if its still around and hasn't left via the EB way. If I find it, I'll post some pics.

Best

M

Originally Posted by Cathey

Hi LaEspadaAncha

Very nice sword, I have not seen a pattern sword actually marked to the 42nd before. Now you have me thinking abaout the black watch I will post the first of three that I have.

Date Circa 1750-70 (18th Century)
Nationality Scottish Black Watch 42nd Highland Regiment

English basket-hilted backsword A Scottish military basket hilted backsword issued to the 42nd Highlanders, circa 1750-1770, older straight single edged fullered blade marked FARARA. Regulation hilt, panels pierced with triangular and circular openings. Truncated conical pommel (marked with an ?) with special button, wire bound leather grip.

If anyone can work out what is on the pommel I would be very grateful. I think they are numbers.

Cheers Cathey

[Jim McDougall]

Cathey and Chris thank you so much!!!! This is absolutely wonderful, I've been hoping to get something going on Scottish basket hilts, and you both come in with Black Watch examples!!!!! Magnificent examples both, and Cathey, thank you for the comprehensive and detailed bibliography on the subject.
Its great to know that another book on Scottish baskethilts is in process, and this is long awaited, especially on those developmental styles up until the '45. Naturally after that and the proscription, most baskethilts fell into the military classification. As noted, the Mazansky reference is probably one of the most comprehensive resources on typology to date.

Cathey, thank you for sharing the outstanding example of these very early basket hilts. There has always been a great deal of confusion concerning the development of the Scottish baskethilt, and I think Claude Blair has done a great job on clarifying much of it in his work in the David Caldwell book.
Naturally much of the nonsense that was once held, such as the ancestry of the baskethilt deriving from the schiavona of the Dalmatians in Venice, which arose in the romanticized notions of some early collectors, has been put to rest.

One thing I would really like to learn more on, and hopefully we can develop here, is perspective on the symbolism often imbued in the work in these Scottish hilts. Whitelaw was probably the first to suggest that Jacobite symbols were covertly emplaced in the piercings and styling in these hilts, and to my knowledge this subject has not been approached in any depth since.

I recall years ago the subject intrigued me, and I set out on a course trying to discover more on this esoteric symbolism. One of the most interesting to me at the time was that of the heart shaped piercings in the saltires of the hilts. I contacted a number of sources including Professor Zygulski in Poland and Mr. Blair himself, and while they considered the subject interesting, conceded it had not been sufficiently researched to comment. As my search continued even Dr. Mazansky, whose notably important book was in progress at the time, pointed out that his interest was more in classification and typology.

Some time ago there were some discussions brought up concerning Jacobite symbols, one being the five point star, but stalled far before productive ideas gained impetus. The subject has since been dormant to the best of my knowledge.
I am hoping that here might look into the development of the Scottish hilts, the styling and forms as well as the symbolism I have mentioned.

With these outstanding examples of these Black Watch baskethilts, it is interesting to consider the profound influence of the heirloom Scottish hilts to the swords used by this incredibly important Scottish regiment.

The military swords in the 1750-70 period were typically produced in England by makers such as Jeffries and Drury in Birmingham if memory serves, and were faithfully designed with Scottish style baskethilts, as seen with the example shown by Cathey, but clearly with heirloom blade as seen with ANDREA FERARA markings. If I am not mistaken, these type hilts were often attributed to the Black Watch, as her excellent example supports.

Manolo, absolutely fascinating to hear of these Black Watch baskethilts there!!! I hope you can find more on them. It seems this regiment was quite represented in the America's, and it would be great to know more on thier presence there in San Juan....it seems I once saw an article about them in Georgia (USA).

It should be noted that during the 18th century, the basket hilt sword was favored for the cavalry, and prevalent with dragoon regiments such as the Royal North British Dragoons (who became known as the Royal Scots Greys).
An interesting feature on many of these hilts is an oval aperture in the hilt which is still debated as to its purpose.

The outstanding example of Black Watch baskethilt that Chris has shared here with regimentally marked hilt, appears to be a heirloom sword, which is a distinct rarity considering the confiscation of weapons after the '45. There is a lot of history here!

It is important to note that the name 'Black Watch' has nothing to do with dark colored tartans or any of those type associations. In the parlance of the times, the term 'black' referred to semantics such as hidden, covert or unknown, and this unit evolved essentially from secret police type groups within the clans. This same application is seen in the term 'skean dubh' for the small knife hidden traditionally in the Highlander stocking. The term 'dubh' in Gaelic = black, literally, but again meant hidden or unseen...skean= knife.
It is said that after the treachery at Glencoe, where Highlanders who had laid down thier arms in a visit were slain, that a small knife kept them armed even after thier regular arms were surrendered.

Thank you again Cathey and Chris!!!!! Fantastic thread and examples!!!

All the very best,
Jim

[Cathey]

Time to post another one

Type of Weapon BASKET-HILT
Date Circa 1714-1750 (18th Century)
Nationality English/Scottish Grenadier Company
Over Length Overall 101.5 cm
Blade length blade 87cm
Blade widest point Width 4cm at widest point near hilt.
Marks, etc Mark on Sword blade, possibly German trade mark.

Description BASKET-HILT English-Scottish 1714-1750 Brass hilted backsword, makers mark and British broad arrow signifying government property on both sides of blade. English Dragoon, plain tapering single edged blade. The open “S” design was adopted for brass-hilted horseman’s swords. This one has a three-quarter basket and a modified ovoid pommel. The quillon is omitted, but the counter guard’s bar bend out on both corners to protect the hand in that area. Its straight single edged blade has a 23.5 cm false edge and a 64 cm fuller.

General Remarks
Note: In the lately discovered regimental History of the Queens Own Hussars (7th Light dragoons) by C.R.B. Barrett and published in tow volumes in 1914, this type of sword is stated to have been used by that regiment, but at a date no later than 1714.

Cheers Cathey

[Jim McDougall]

Cathey, this brass basket hilt is pretty fantastic!
I really like the professional format in which you present these, and its great to have them shared here as references, it really is very much appreciated.

I think the period you propose is quite accurate.Interestingly Anthony Darling in 1974 noted that British brass hilted cavalry swords are rarely seen, but then curiously notes that the 3rd Kings Own Regiment of Dragoons had them (not necessarily of this type). I agree with the grenadier assessment you note, and would think of this as an English rather than Scottish basket hilt.

While Mazansky is great in assigning classifications, there is little information added in order to accomplish any pertinant research other than noting his classification numerals for identification. It would be helpful if the black and white photos noted whether the hilts are brass or not, as with the examples of this hilt shown. The book overall is outstanding as a reference for typology of basket type hilts, but for that aspect alone, and I really look forward to a reference on basket hilts with some attention to symbolism and historical details.

The interesting blade marking certainly suggests a Solingen blade, and this 'anchor' type mark is closely associated with devices like this in merchants marks, as well as makers marks of the late 16th through the 17th century. Despite these cross and orb, anchor, cross and patibulum type devices being associated with certain makers it is believed many became simply ornamental as talismanic marks or of course implied quality.

Where is the arrow marking situated?

Again Cathey thank you so much for these outstanding posts!!!!

All the best,
Jim

[Rikkn]

Here is one for you Cathey ..... This one was a prop for the 60's British T.V. series " The Avenger " ( hung on the wall of John Steeds office ).

[Rikkn]

Added picture - didn't work first time.

[Rikkn]

Trying again.....

[Cathey]

Hi Rikkn

Appears to be a copy of an early swept hilt rapier, not a basket hilt.

Cheers Cathey

[Jim McDougall]

Originally Posted by Rikkn

Here is one for you Cathey ..... This one was a prop for the 60's British T.V. series " The Avenger " ( hung on the wall of John Steeds office ).

Hey man, who can remember the 60's!!!???
Really though, gotta love the drapery rod quillon terminals.
Thanks Rikkn,

All the best,
Jim

[celtan]

Yep. Gotta remember the cool, leather clad Emma Peel...

Hey, kids got memories too!

: )

BTW, the lasso-guard sword looks too nicely designed for such an uninspiring crossguard/quillions.

M

Originally Posted by Jim McDougall

Hey man, who can remember the 60's!!!???
Really though, gotta love the drapery rod quillon terminals.
Thanks Rikkn,

All the best,
Jim

[fernando]

Originally Posted by celtan

... BTW, the lasso-guard sword looks too nicely designed for such an uninspiring crossguard/quillions...

En absoluto .

[Jim McDougall]

Well observed Manolo and Nando!
Good example of a rapier fabricated 'by the numbers'!!! and as Cathey notes, not a basket hilt......which would have followed different blueprints .
And yeah, I can see Emma Peel vaguely through the purple haze!!!

All the best,
Jim

[Mark Deyer]

Hi,
Here,s my contribution a 1731 dated one recently picked up from the family any info on it would be helpful.the inside of the cross gaurd is coverd in a black pitch type material and it is evident that it once covered the out side of the hilt as well the all is original,only thing ever done to it it has a old tape repair to the bottom of the scabbard.
Thanks Mark

[Jim McDougall]

Mark, this is an absolutely magnificent example of a mid 18th century British dragoon basket hilt! Welcome to the forum, and thank you so much not only for the grand entrance with this beauty! but for reviving this fascinating old thread.

The late Anthony Darling wrote his venerable article on these, "The British Basket Hilted Cavalry Sword" in 1974 ("Canadian Journal of Arms Collecting" Vol 7, #3) and on p.86 (fig 7 group) is one which is remarkably similar to yours. This is regarded as an Anglo-Irish hilt type with a horizontal bar bisecting the arms of the basket, and these are believed to have been English made. The absence of the looping bars at the base of the basket seem another indicator of this classification.

Dr. Cyril Mazansky , "British Basket Hilted Cavalry Swords" (2005) classifies the pommel type as 'tall bun' (type IID) and on p75, the group of hilts in F1 seem to follow closely the basic design. These are again English dragoon hilts.

Darling (op.cit.) notes that while many of these dragon hilts were made in London and Birmingham, some were also produced in Glasgow and Stirling, which were garrison towns. The ring around the base of the pommel seems to suggest mid 18th around 1750s, and most examples of this period have this feature. It is noted that the British dragoon hilts were quite sturdier than the Scottish hilts, and of course plain without piercings and other motif.

I am not sure on the '45' which seems scratched into the scabbard throat. It does not seem to correspond to regimental numerals often seen (i.e. 42 was the Black Watch, 42nd Foot). Darling indicates this particular type hilt as seen on yours is in his opinion one the finest forms of these dragoon hilts, and these were apparently associated with the 6th Inniskillings (Heavy dragoons).

May we know more on the blade, length, any markings please . How is the 1731 date attributed?

Fantastic piece!!!!


All best regards,
Jim

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

Originally Posted by Jim McDougall

Mark, this is an absolutely magnificent example of a mid 18th century British dragoon basket hilt! Welcome to the forum, and thank you so much not only for the grand entrance with this beauty! but for reviving this fascinating old thread.

The late Anthony Darling wrote his venerable article on these, "The British Basket Hilted Cavalry Sword" in 1974 ("Canadian Journal of Arms Collecting" Vol 7, #3) and on p.86 (fig 7 group) is one which is remarkably similar to yours. This is regarded as an Anglo-Irish hilt type with a horizontal bar bisecting the arms of the basket, and these are believed to have been English made. The absence of the looping bars at the base of the basket seem another indicator of this classification.

Dr. Cyril Mazansky , "British Basket Hilted Cavalry Swords" (2005) classifies the pommel type as 'tall bun' (type IID) and on p75, the group of hilts in F1 seem to follow closely the basic design. These are again English dragoon hilts.

Darling (op.cit.) notes that while many of these dragon hilts were made in London and Birmingham, some were also produced in Glasgow and Stirling, which were garrison towns. The ring around the base of the pommel seems to suggest mid 18th around 1750s, and most examples of this period have this feature. It is noted that the British dragoon hilts were quite sturdier than the Scottish hilts, and of course plain without piercings and other motif.

I am not sure on the '45' which seems scratched into the scabbard throat. It does not seem to correspond to regimental numerals often seen (i.e. 42 was the Black Watch, 42nd Foot). Darling indicates this particular type hilt as seen on yours is in his opinion one the finest forms of these dragoon hilts, and these were apparently associated with the 6th Inniskillings (Heavy dragoons).

May we know more on the blade, length, any markings please . How is the 1731 date attributed?

Fantastic piece!!!!


All best regards,
Jim

Salaams Jim, Lovely subject by Cathey! Perhaps this 45 is a reference to this Wikepedia historical page Quote''The Jacobite rising of 1745, often referred to as "The 'Forty-Five", was the attempt by Charles Edward Stuart to regain the British throne for the exiled House of Stuart, and recreate an absolute monarchy in the Kingdom of Great Britain[citation needed]. The rising occurred during the War of the Austrian Succession when most of the British Army was on the European continent. Charles Edward Stuart, commonly known as "Bonnie Prince Charlie" or "the Young Pretender," sailed to Scotland and raised the Jacobite standard at Glenfinnan in the Scottish Highlands, where he was supported by a gathering of Highland clansmen. The march south began with an initial victory at Prestonpans near Edinburgh. The Jacobite army, now in bold spirits, marched onwards to Carlisle, over the border in England. When it reached Derby, some British divisions were recalled from the Continent and the Jacobite army retreated north to Inverness where the last battle on Scottish soil took place on a nearby moor at Culloden. The Battle of Culloden ended with the final defeat of the Jacobite cause, and with Charles Edward Stuart fleeing with a price on his head. His wanderings in the northwest Highlands and Islands of Scotland in the summer months of 1746, before finally sailing to permanent exile in France, have become an era of Scottish history that is steeped in romance.'' Unquote.


See Below ..."The Battle of Culloden" by David Morier from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Culloden

Regards,
Ibrahiim al Balooshi.

[Jim McDougall]

Thank you Ibrahiim, outstanding coverage on the Scottish Rebellion of 1745, the '45', and that had crossed my mind. While it would be tempting to presume this kind of patriotic imbuement, it does not fall into place with the nature of the sword, nor its placement, though I would not suggest spurious placement. Numbers placed in similar manner and in various locations may be inventory or issue related numbers, most of which remain unclear and outside most recorded explanations.
These kinds of swords were used by dragoon troopers in British regiments after Scottish subjugation, and while many were of course Scottish, it does not seem likely such a marker would have been in place on one of these swords.

I had forgotten to add to my earlier post that many forms of these English made basket hilts often had a feature within the arms and saltires of the structure an oval ring which has become generally held to be for use in holding the reins, and these are accordingly regarded as horsemans swords.
The absence of this feature does not preclude its use as a cavalry sword, but I wanted to include that detail for general reference.

[stephen wood]

Do you think this is one of the military pattern swords? It is marked "No. 16" on the hilt.

[A Senefelder]

Salaams Jim, Lovely subject by Cathey! Perhaps this 45 is a reference to this Wikepedia historical page Quote''The Jacobite rising of 1745, often referred to as "The 'Forty-Five", was the attempt by Charles Edward Stuart to regain the British throne for the exiled House of Stuart, and recreate an absolute monarchy in the Kingdom of Great Britain[citation needed]. The rising occurred during the War of the Austrian Succession when most of the British Army was on the European continent. Charles Edward Stuart, commonly known as "Bonnie Prince Charlie" or "the Young Pretender," sailed to Scotland and raised the Jacobite standard at Glenfinnan in the Scottish Highlands, where he was supported by a gathering of Highland clansmen. The march south began with an initial victory at Prestonpans near Edinburgh. The Jacobite army, now in bold spirits, marched onwards to Carlisle, over the border in England. When it reached Derby, some British divisions were recalled from the Continent and the Jacobite army retreated north to Inverness where the last battle on Scottish soil took place on a nearby moor at Culloden. The Battle of Culloden ended with the final defeat of the Jacobite cause, and with Charles Edward Stuart fleeing with a price on his head. His wanderings in the northwest Highlands and Islands of Scotland in the summer months of 1746, before finally sailing to permanent exile in France, have become an era of Scottish history that is steeped in romance.'' Unquote.

This is my understanding as well. My great uncle Max was president of the clan Maclean here in America when I was young and this is what he explained to me which sincs up with all that I've read since. It better be it's incorporated into a tattoo of the clans history I have.

[E.B. Erickson]

I'm a bit late posting here, but that's because I teach at an international school in Thailand but my sword collection is in storage in the US and is inaccessible for photography. Last week I was going through a box of old vacation photos and discovered a forgotten cache of pictures of many of my swords. This week I began scanning them and plan on posting a couple each day or two to this thread.

So first up is a Scottish basket ca. 1680.
38" de blade, with twin short fullers at the forte,and a shallow moderately wide fuller extending down the blade for about 8".
The basket is of flat ribbon construction, with the unusual feature of an oval panel on the side knucklebows; there is an oval panel on the front knucklebow as well.

More to come! --ElJay

[E.B. Erickson]

Scottish brass basket from the first half of the 1700s.
36" se blade with triple fullers, stamped on the left side with sickle marks and 3 dots at the end of the sickle's arcs.
Very large pommel to balance the blade, otherwise typical construction for one of these.
Grip is leather covered, bound with brass wire and Turk's head knots. I think that the leather is probably a restoration, but it looks OK.

--ElJay

[E.B. Erickson]

Scottish, ca 1680
33" de blade with central fuller engraved "ELVIEGO SAHAGUN". There's an indistinct circular stamp at the end of the fuller.
Basket construction is normal, but the smith elected to cut small rectangular slots in the pommel to receive the ends of the hilt. This is a feature usually seen on earlier ribbonhilts.
Grip has some wormholes and is covered in old hard leather.

[E.B. Erickson]

English hilt based on a heart shaped guard pierced with scrollwork.
Blade 35" se, with the typical narrow and wide fullering.
Grip is shagreen bound with copper wire

[E.B. Erickson]

Typical English munition grade military basket, probably ca. 1650 or earlier. The hilt has a few traces of engraved decoration.
34" de blade, signed in the fullers "ANDRIA FERARA".
Grip is a modern replacement, but is well done.

[E.B. Erickson]

English, ca 1700. Hit of thin bars with fleur de lis (?), hearts, and "hooks" (I don't know what else to call them).
34" de blade, inscribed in the fuller "IESU MARIA".
Grip is sharkskin, bound with a broken copper wire, finished at each end with gilt ferrules.
Mazansky p. 175 has a hilt that's essentially a twin to this one.

[E.B. Erickson]

English, ca. 1750 (?)
34" se blade with narrow back fuller. The blade bears a few traces of etching.
The grip is of rayskin bound with copper wire, and is a restoration that I did myself.
Mazansky p.144-145 shows similar hilts.

[E.B. Erickson]

English, last half of the 1700s.
34" se blade with wide and narrow fullers, has been shortened as the fuller runs through the tip.
The basket is semi symmetrical, with 3 scroll ended bars to each side, but those on the right are larger and have connecting bars. The hilt is of very robust construction, and is finished and done so well that I think that this is an officer's sword.

[E.B. Erickson]

English, last half of the 1700s.
36" earlier de blade of flattened hexagon section, stamped at the forte with 3 groups of pellet marks.
Grip is shagreen bound with copper wire.
Mazansky p. 207 depicts similar hilts.
Years ago I found an old "Museum of Historical Arms" catalog from 1964, and this sword was illustrated and up for sale. Price back then? $65.