BEATIFUL KAMPILAN HILT

carlos · 9th April 2005, 10:16 AM

HI EVERYBODY!
I HAVE THIS KAMPILAN SEVERAL YEARS AND ALWAYS I HAVE BEEN WONDERING ABOUT THE MEANING OF THIS JINGLES BEELS AND THIS TAPE OF CLOTH IN THE HILT. SOMEBODY KNOW THIS?
THANKS
CARLOS

carlos · 9th April 2005, 10:20 AM

AND ANOTHER PICTURE.

tom hyle · 9th April 2005, 12:41 PM

Sweet; nice bells; thanks.

Spunjer · 9th April 2005, 02:18 PM

hi carlos,

the cloth might be an anting-anting, or amulet. also, i can picture someone wrapping the cloth on his hands so the sword won't slip. the bells reminds me of those t'boli hawkbells i saw in davao.

Ian · 9th April 2005, 03:01 PM

Carlos:

Nice example of a well maintained kampilan. It is unusual to see them with so much hair left on the hilt. The hawk bells are indeed reminiscent of the T'boli decorations, and are not standard Moro fare. The T'boli have traded with Mindanao Muslims for many years, so it is not surprising that hawk bells could end up on a kampilan.

The strip of material has been described as a means of binding the sword to the wrist, as Spunjer has said, but I have never found a good reference for such a use. Similar attachments appear on a few kris.

Interesting kampilan.

Ian.

tom hyle · 9th April 2005, 03:56 PM

Would an anting-anting have any heraldic/identificatory value? Is the pattern in some sense a "flag"? Of course, most "tribal" conflicts occur between groups who can readily identifyl each other by pretty nearly every aspect of their dress, equipage, and personal appearance, due to the intensely regional/ethnic variation one sees in so much of the old handmade stuff......but perhaps to mark a faction; a town? someone's bodyguards? etc? Really just an idea; not anything I've heard or have any specific reason to think is true..........

Spunjer · 9th April 2005, 04:59 PM

interesting point, tom. seems to be the sandatas i saw that has flowing cloth strips are the ones that are actual battle weapons that are battlefield pick ups. so are these strips added just before going to a battle for added good luck?

Rick · 9th April 2005, 05:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spunjer

interesting point, tom. seems to be the sandatas i saw that has flowing cloth strips are the ones that are actual battle weapons that are battlefield pick ups. so are these strips added just before going to a battle for added good luck?

Were they anting - anting I would expect them to have some prayers etc. written on them or some small object sewn inside .

I'd suggest that more likely this is used to firmly bind the sword to the hand in combat .

tom hyle · 9th April 2005, 05:57 PM

Let me be clear that I am in no way suggesting that it is not used as a lanyard (to be broad), but that the pattern may also have some.....the idea of doing it just before battle made me think of this......organizational/unit-designation type meaning? Just guessing around......

nosmo king · 10th April 2005, 02:09 AM

great kampilan,I believe those bells are called tiger bells.Not a very common bell in the PI.

tom hyle · 10th April 2005, 06:38 AM

the faces are beautiful, and reminiscent somehow of MesoAmerican art. They appear to be soldered/brazed up of mould-cast(?) halves....or the halves could easily be pressed from wax in a wooden (for instance; or soapstone) mould, and joined, then coated with slip, then melted out and cast. The Lumad "hawk bells" I've seen were of a similar shape, much smaller, of course, but built up by hand-coiling a tiny wax cord upon its self to build up the wall of the bell; not in 2 halves, and then lost-wax cast.

nosmo king · 10th April 2005, 02:14 PM

Tiger bell's are a study in themselves.Every little design feature has specific meaning.Here's a great link : http://park.org/Guests/Tiger/details.htm

Spunjer · 10th April 2005, 02:51 PM

wow! thanks nosmo king. very informative website. btw, is that your panabas in your avatar, and if it is, mind showing us some close ups

?

Ian · 10th April 2005, 06:31 PM

Nosmo king:

Those are indeed tiger bells with the characteristic stylized tiger's head! There is a very helpful web site that talks about tiger bells here:

http://parallel.park.org/Guests/Tiger/bells.htm

Ian.

Ooops. That link has already been posted above. Sorry.

nosmo king · 10th April 2005, 07:15 PM

Thanks Spunger,Yes that is a Panabas that I own.It came from the collection of a Henry De Pue who collected from 1898 to the early twenties.The blade is a full 7/16'' thick at the base!! This one is a serious "chopper".Also sharp as a razor!!!! All original , never messed with.

nosmo king · 10th April 2005, 07:37 PM

Hi Spunger,Here's some pics:

nosmo king · 10th April 2005, 08:58 PM

OOps... sorry about the "g" spunjer.

ibeam · 10th April 2005, 09:57 PM

Carlos,
Here is another example of a Kampilan with tiger Bells. This was offered to me a few years back but passed on it. Really interesting that there are other examples out there.

Nosmo King,
Do you have other Kampilans you can share with us??

BTW, very nice panabas. Thank you for sharing pics.

tom hyle · 10th April 2005, 11:03 PM

The surfaces of the panabas seem to be crosshatched draw-filed, with forging dents and scale-pits left in if lower than the desired/defined surface plane, as common. Nice, particularly "tribal"/village quality looking.

nosmo king · 11th April 2005, 01:08 AM

Hello ibeam,I do have a lumad kampilan that I feel relates to this particular thread.It is an old ,really complete example.Loaded with all the "bells and whistles" of a chieftains sword.Even a large tiger bell !!!! The beadwork is just beautiful and the fit of the attachments is really well done.It is wrapped under the beadwork with abaca cloth and many other varieties I am not familiar with.Hope the photos are OK.The lighting was not too swift.I'll do better in the future!!!

tom hyle · 11th April 2005, 01:30 AM

do you find this blade reminiscent of Mandaya bolos? But it is not Mandaya, is it?

nosmo king · 11th April 2005, 02:30 AM

Tom,I'm pretty sure the kamp is Bagobo.You are right on the money with the Mandayan influence between the two styles.It always interests me how neighboring tribes influence eachother,but still retain their their own uniqueness!!!Here are a few pics of a Mandayan bolo in my posession for many years.
BTW,ibeam ID this bolo for me a while back(I used to be "slowcountry" in my former life) I can't remember the exact name for this particular bolo

Rick · 11th April 2005, 02:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nosmo king

Hello ibeam,I do have a lumad kampilan that I feel relates to this particular thread.It is an old ,really complete example.Loaded with all the "bells and whistles" of a chieftains sword.Even a large tiger bell !!!! The beadwork is just beautiful and the fit of the attachments is really well done.It is wrapped under the beadwork with abaca cloth and many other varieties I am not familiar with.Hope the photos are OK.The lighting was not too swift.I'll do better in the future!!!

Fellas , I've got to ask ; what makes this sword a Kampilan ?

Andrew · 11th April 2005, 04:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nosmo king

BTW,ibeam ID this bolo for me a while back(I used to be "slowcountry" in my former life)

Your new user name had me rolling!

Welcome back.

nosmo king · 11th April 2005, 04:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick

Fellas , I've got to ask ; what makes this sword a Kampilan ?

Hi Rick,I just got used to calling any large lumad sword a kampilan for lack of a better word .I think I just like to say "Kampilan".It has a nice ring to it!!

nosmo king · 11th April 2005, 04:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew

Your new user name had me rolling!

Welcome back.

Thanks Andrew,I wanted a name I could see posted in restaurants and all public places!!!

ibeam · 11th April 2005, 11:37 PM

Hello Nismo King,
Thank you for posting pictures of your very nice sword collection. Glad to know you still have that Mandaya bolo.

Federico · 12th April 2005, 01:42 AM

Wow...beautiful Kampilan Carlos. Are my eyes seeing right, and the hilt is made of banati? Ive only seen a couple banati hilted kampilan. Very beautiful. The mansala is interesting as well, nice pattern.

Rick, as far as Ive read, and iffen the similarity between the Moro practice of Anting-Anting and Xtian anting-anitng are truly similar, what constitutes an anting-anting can vary wildly. From heavily inscribed cloth, to simple plain cloth that has been prayed over, to rocks, shells, shards of wood, etc... So, even the plain un-inscribe red mansalas could be antin-anting if there was some significance to the cloth's origin.

I suppose, for all the theorizing, we should also not underestimate the power of it looks nice why not add it.

Rick · 12th April 2005, 02:31 AM

True Federico , true .

Does this negate the possibility that these swords were bound to the user's hand by these strips sometimes . ?

Ian · 12th April 2005, 03:01 AM

Nosmo:

The Bagobo and Mandaya bolos are wonderful examples of the respective traditional forms. Two of the best I have seen. Congrats.

Ian.

9th April 2005, 10:16 AM	#1
carlos Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 737	BEATIFUL KAMPILAN HILT HI EVERYBODY! I HAVE THIS KAMPILAN SEVERAL YEARS AND ALWAYS I HAVE BEEN WONDERING ABOUT THE MEANING OF THIS JINGLES BEELS AND THIS TAPE OF CLOTH IN THE HILT. SOMEBODY KNOW THIS? THANKS CARLOS Attached Images

9th April 2005, 10:20 AM	#2
carlos Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 737	AND ANOTHER PICTURE. Attached Images

9th April 2005, 02:18 PM	#4
Spunjer Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Witness Protection Program Posts: 1,730	hi carlos, the cloth might be an anting-anting, or amulet. also, i can picture someone wrapping the cloth on his hands so the sword won't slip. the bells reminds me of those t'boli hawkbells i saw in davao. Last edited by Spunjer; 9th April 2005 at 02:31 PM.

9th April 2005, 03:56 PM	#6
tom hyle Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Houston, TX, USA Posts: 1,254	Would an anting-anting have any heraldic/identificatory value? Is the pattern in some sense a "flag"? Of course, most "tribal" conflicts occur between groups who can readily identifyl each other by pretty nearly every aspect of their dress, equipage, and personal appearance, due to the intensely regional/ethnic variation one sees in so much of the old handmade stuff......but perhaps to mark a faction; a town? someone's bodyguards? etc? Really just an idea; not anything I've heard or have any specific reason to think is true.......... Last edited by tom hyle; 9th April 2005 at 03:56 PM. Reason: "identificatory" is hard to spell if it's even a "word"

10th April 2005, 06:31 PM	#14
Ian Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Aussie Bush Posts: 4,200	Nosmo king: Those are indeed tiger bells with the characteristic stylized tiger's head! There is a very helpful web site that talks about tiger bells here: http://parallel.park.org/Guests/Tiger/bells.htm Ian. Ooops. That link has already been posted above. Sorry. Last edited by Ian; 10th April 2005 at 06:42 PM.

9th April 2005, 12:41 PM	#3
tom hyle Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Houston, TX, USA Posts: 1,254	Sweet; nice bells; thanks.

9th April 2005, 03:01 PM	#5
Ian Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Aussie Bush Posts: 4,200	Carlos: Nice example of a well maintained kampilan. It is unusual to see them with so much hair left on the hilt. The hawk bells are indeed reminiscent of the T'boli decorations, and are not standard Moro fare. The T'boli have traded with Mindanao Muslims for many years, so it is not surprising that hawk bells could end up on a kampilan. The strip of material has been described as a means of binding the sword to the wrist, as Spunjer has said, but I have never found a good reference for such a use. Similar attachments appear on a few kris. Interesting kampilan. Ian.

9th April 2005, 04:59 PM	#7
Spunjer Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Witness Protection Program Posts: 1,730	interesting point, tom. seems to be the sandatas i saw that has flowing cloth strips are the ones that are actual battle weapons that are battlefield pick ups. so are these strips added just before going to a battle for added good luck?

9th April 2005, 05:57 PM	#9
tom hyle Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Houston, TX, USA Posts: 1,254	Let me be clear that I am in no way suggesting that it is not used as a lanyard (to be broad), but that the pattern may also have some.....the idea of doing it just before battle made me think of this......organizational/unit-designation type meaning? Just guessing around......

10th April 2005, 02:09 AM	#10
nosmo king Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 15	great kampilan,I believe those bells are called tiger bells.Not a very common bell in the PI.

10th April 2005, 06:38 AM	#11
tom hyle Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Houston, TX, USA Posts: 1,254	the faces are beautiful, and reminiscent somehow of MesoAmerican art. They appear to be soldered/brazed up of mould-cast(?) halves....or the halves could easily be pressed from wax in a wooden (for instance; or soapstone) mould, and joined, then coated with slip, then melted out and cast. The Lumad "hawk bells" I've seen were of a similar shape, much smaller, of course, but built up by hand-coiling a tiny wax cord upon its self to build up the wall of the bell; not in 2 halves, and then lost-wax cast.

10th April 2005, 02:14 PM	#12
nosmo king Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 15	Tiger bell's are a study in themselves.Every little design feature has specific meaning.Here's a great link : http://park.org/Guests/Tiger/details.htm

10th April 2005, 02:51 PM	#13
Spunjer Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Witness Protection Program Posts: 1,730	wow! thanks nosmo king. very informative website. btw, is that your panabas in your avatar, and if it is, mind showing us some close ups ?

10th April 2005, 07:15 PM	#15
nosmo king Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 15	Thanks Spunger,Yes that is a Panabas that I own.It came from the collection of a Henry De Pue who collected from 1898 to the early twenties.The blade is a full 7/16'' thick at the base!! This one is a serious "chopper".Also sharp as a razor!!!! All original , never messed with.

10th April 2005, 07:37 PM	#16
nosmo king Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 15	Hi Spunger,Here's some pics: Attached Images

10th April 2005, 08:58 PM	#17
nosmo king Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 15	OOps... sorry about the "g" spunjer.

10th April 2005, 09:57 PM	#18
ibeam Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: New Jersey Posts: 134	Carlos, Here is another example of a Kampilan with tiger Bells. This was offered to me a few years back but passed on it. Really interesting that there are other examples out there. Nosmo King, Do you have other Kampilans you can share with us?? BTW, very nice panabas. Thank you for sharing pics. Attached Images

10th April 2005, 11:03 PM	#19
tom hyle Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Houston, TX, USA Posts: 1,254	The surfaces of the panabas seem to be crosshatched draw-filed, with forging dents and scale-pits left in if lower than the desired/defined surface plane, as common. Nice, particularly "tribal"/village quality looking.

11th April 2005, 01:08 AM	#20
nosmo king Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 15	Hello ibeam,I do have a lumad kampilan that I feel relates to this particular thread.It is an old ,really complete example.Loaded with all the "bells and whistles" of a chieftains sword.Even a large tiger bell !!!! The beadwork is just beautiful and the fit of the attachments is really well done.It is wrapped under the beadwork with abaca cloth and many other varieties I am not familiar with.Hope the photos are OK.The lighting was not too swift.I'll do better in the future!!! Attached Images

11th April 2005, 01:30 AM	#21
tom hyle Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Houston, TX, USA Posts: 1,254	do you find this blade reminiscent of Mandaya bolos? But it is not Mandaya, is it?

11th April 2005, 02:30 AM	#22
nosmo king Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 15	Tom,I'm pretty sure the kamp is Bagobo.You are right on the money with the Mandayan influence between the two styles.It always interests me how neighboring tribes influence eachother,but still retain their their own uniqueness!!!Here are a few pics of a Mandayan bolo in my posession for many years. BTW,ibeam ID this bolo for me a while back(I used to be "slowcountry" in my former life) I can't remember the exact name for this particular bolo Attached Images

11th April 2005, 11:37 PM	#27
ibeam Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: New Jersey Posts: 134	Hello Nismo King, Thank you for posting pictures of your very nice sword collection. Glad to know you still have that Mandaya bolo.

12th April 2005, 01:42 AM	#28
Federico Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Minneapolis, MN, USA Posts: 312	Wow...beautiful Kampilan Carlos. Are my eyes seeing right, and the hilt is made of banati? Ive only seen a couple banati hilted kampilan. Very beautiful. The mansala is interesting as well, nice pattern. Rick, as far as Ive read, and iffen the similarity between the Moro practice of Anting-Anting and Xtian anting-anitng are truly similar, what constitutes an anting-anting can vary wildly. From heavily inscribed cloth, to simple plain cloth that has been prayed over, to rocks, shells, shards of wood, etc... So, even the plain un-inscribe red mansalas could be antin-anting if there was some significance to the cloth's origin. I suppose, for all the theorizing, we should also not underestimate the power of it looks nice why not add it.

12th April 2005, 02:31 AM	#29
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,293	True Federico , true . Does this negate the possibility that these swords were bound to the user's hand by these strips sometimes . ?

12th April 2005, 03:01 AM	#30
Ian Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Aussie Bush Posts: 4,200	Nosmo: The Bagobo and Mandaya bolos are wonderful examples of the respective traditional forms. Two of the best I have seen. Congrats. Ian.