Smallsword Info (named Sebastian Ernandes)

[RogerFox]

Hello everyone fellows. I'm a mail armor collector and restorer, but i recently bought a very nice smallsword. I would like your knowledge to learn a bit more about it... if possible

As you can see on the blade with the triple fuller there is an inscription XX Sabastian X Ernandes XX. I know that probably is a "fake" name as they used to make for make more valuable the blade itself... but you can also see the "anchor" mark at the end of the fuller.

The hilt is quite interesting, couse it looks composed in different periods, plus the (arch guard, i don't know the name) is made by movable pieces and not from a single molded one as usual.

Any tought about this piece that can help me identify it? Thank you very much.

[fernando]

Welcome to the forum, Roger .
You are right in saying that famous master names are often used to value up swords made by common smiths ... or even pure fakes.
Sebastian Hernandez was the name for both father and son. We can see their personal marks in the Toledo Palomares nomina (chart). You may check if their marks are shown in the blade ricasso (behind the guard). It could be that this hilt doesn't have a Toledan origin, judging by its style. But don't rely in my humble judgement. Let us just wait for members more within this typology.



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[RogerFox]

I got someone that told me the blade could be a german one. But i’m not an expert so… Is there an high chance that blade and hilth are from differend period… and even the hilth components are probably from different provenance.

[Jim McDougall]

Fernando, thank you for always furnishing references from Palomares, which is such a valuable resource, and noting the Hernandez father and son. I have always wondered about the '3' which has been suggested (inconclusively) this might be a cursive 'Z' for Zaragoza, where some Toledo makers also worked.

This very attractive small sword is Georgian, hilted in the faceted 'cut steel' manner of Boulton, late 18th century London.
The use of spurious Spanish names and marks on sword blades was very much standard practice in Germany, especially Solingen, who of course was a primary source for English cutlers.

The use of SEBASTIAN (often without the surname) was not necessarily common, but relatively frequent on blades through the 17th century, so this blade is of course surely from much earlier period. Most likely it might have been a heirloom blade remounted into a more fashionable hilt of later time.

In analogy:
Attached is a Scottish basket hilt of Glasgow form mounted about end of 17th c. with a quite early Solingen blade (see Wirsberg mark c. 1620s?) and with the name SEBASTIAN in large letters. This of course alludes to the Hernandez as discussed, but the lettering of course unusual....the reversed S sometimes may have nuanced connection to 'magic' symbols. The familiar 'anchor' was another somewhat nuanced device from Spain spuriously used by Solingen artisans decorating blades.

The 'arches' mentioned are the pas d'ane rings, which were typically vestigial, that is somewhat flatter, in this late period.

[RogerFox]

Thank you Jim, you looks pretty sure abut what you are saying. Thats cool. One thing that really catch my eyes is the fact that the name calligraphy is made very well, for sure who made it took his time to give it a very good look. The way the A are done is quite unique.

Anyway with the "arch" i was referring to the big one, where you put the four fingers. That one is composed by separately 3 pieces and all of them are free to move... instead of just 1 molded one.


A video will show this quite well, but i dunno if i can upload one.

[fernando]

It is admitable that name misspells in sword blades, although often practiced by imitators, also occur with the genuine owners; omiting the H or writing S instead of Z in Hernandez could also happen.
One thing noticed with Hernandez master/s is that, their personal mark seems to always appear in their blades. Assuming Roger's blade is genuine, the only reason the mark in the ricasso doesn't show would be becasuse it was hidden by the ferrule used to set it up with the present hilt assembly. But of course, this is my fantasy working.
As for the symbol in their mark being a Z and not a 3, perhaps doubts should cease, as well known period authors, Lhermite for one, treat it as a Z. Either drawing it in their notes or even name it in the feminine, while the number 3 is masculine.





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[toaster5sqn]

What you are calling the arch then is correctly known as the knuckle bow these days. Although I am aware of one period source (Rowarth) who refers to it as the 'ward iron'.

Robert

[Radboud]

Originally Posted by Jim McDougall

The 'arches' mentioned are the pas d'ane rings, which were typically vestigial, that is somewhat flatter, in this late period.

This is a common mistake that has been reprinted in several books. “Pas d’ane” is a French term which literally translates to ‘donkey’s hoof’ that is used for a specific style of sword guard, because of its appearance from above. In English we would call it a clamshell guard, because from above it looks like an opened clamshell.

The half rings between the crossguard / knuckle bow and shell guard are called ‘Annulets’.

Originally Posted by Jim McDougall

May I ask which reference is 'Rowarth' ? the name is not familiar.
The term 'ward iron' is intriguing!
Other terms are fascinating as well, such as pas d'ane

Charles Roworth was the author of the late 18th Century treatise on sword fighting titled “The Art of Defence on Foot”. It is a popular training manual for HEMA practitioners of late 18th and early 19th Century fencing.

Copies of the treatise are available online for free.

[Radboud]

for reference (source):

[Jim McDougall]

That is EXCELLENT elucidation Radboud!
Its great to have the proper updates on terms, I saw the donkey hoof thing in Egerton Castle (1885).