Takouba with old european blade

Yvain · 9th June 2023, 01:12 PM

Hi all!

Today I received this takouba that I won at an auction some weeks ago! As you can imagine, I'm very pleased with it. The mounts are in an older style (late 19th century perhaps), but the most interesting part is the blade.

It seems to be an older european blade that was locally "sandwiched". On both face, the blade bears a wolf of Passau, and the inscription "SAHAGVM". Alfonso de Sahagún was a Spanish smith from the second part of the 16th century, but his signature was copied a lot, including on some Passau blades. The general shape of the blade, fuller, and marks makes me think that it could be from the second part of the 16th century, or perhaps early 17th century.

Some similar blades : https://www.antique-swords.com/AA96-...-Mortuary.html

https://www.olympiaauctions.com/sale.../view-lot/118/

https://collection.maas.museum/object/249330

Anyway, I’m really happy about it! (And sorry for the not so good pictures, I'm preparing for moving out and don't have much space)

Lee · 9th June 2023, 02:12 PM

Very nice! If you slap the flat of the blade against your thigh and find it 'springy' (that is, it vibrates for a moment) that would argue for it being the old European blade it certainly appears to be, rather than an antique local copy that would very quickly dampen out the vibration.

Look for: Briggs, Lloyd Cabot, "European Blades in Tuareg Swords and Daggers," The Journal of the Arms & Armour Society [U.K.] Vol. V. No. 2. (1965), p. 37 - 92.

Yvain · 9th June 2023, 04:21 PM

The sandwiched ricasso dampens the vibrations a bit but the blade is springy and behaves correctly for a European piece. (I also don't think I ever saw a locally made takouba blade with this shape, but it could have happened indeed). I have the article you mention, I will have to search for it on my computer!

TVV · 9th June 2023, 05:28 PM

Congratulations, looks like an old European blade indeed. The sandwich construction was used for older blades that had been remounted multiple times causing wear to the tang.

Yvain · 10th June 2023, 01:15 AM

Indeed TVV, I have another one like this. Though in this case I think the main goal could have been to lengthen the blade, as the "sandwich" part doesn't hide the beginning of the blade

Jim McDougall · 10th June 2023, 04:23 PM

I agree with the consensus here, this appears to be a European blade and has suffered the torments consistent with the Sahara, with these blades that came into this sphere through the 19th century through Mediterranean trade. These circulated for many generations and went through many alterations in their repeated remounting.

The 'Passau' wolf seems well executed and consistent with the standard configurations typically used in Solingen work. The SAHAGUM was one of the many also consistent names etc. used spuriously in Solingen implying the work of makers in Toledo.It seems blades using this name were typically destined for North Europe, but obviously these like others often ended up in varying circumstances.

The 'sandwiched' metal applied at the forte is a strengthening application commonly used in the Sahara for blades often remounted as Teodor notes, if I recall termed 'adabal'. The rebated point of the blade is also to tribal preference and in accord with the slashing cuts used by Tuareg tribesmen.

The blade has fared well relatively with the markings as these were typically scoured often in sharpening using stones and such rugged methods. The new reddish rust may be from moisture arising in its location for a time especially if scabbarded. Its always hard to tell from photos but the metal seems otherwise unusually bright.

Marc M. · 10th June 2023, 04:39 PM

Hi Yvain

Nice takuba and a good european blade. Best to remove the active rust.

Regards
Marc

9th June 2023, 01:12 PM	#1
Yvain Member Join Date: May 2017 Location: France Posts: 178	Takouba with old european blade Hi all! Today I received this takouba that I won at an auction some weeks ago! As you can imagine, I'm very pleased with it. The mounts are in an older style (late 19th century perhaps), but the most interesting part is the blade. It seems to be an older european blade that was locally "sandwiched". On both face, the blade bears a wolf of Passau, and the inscription "SAHAGVM". Alfonso de Sahagún was a Spanish smith from the second part of the 16th century, but his signature was copied a lot, including on some Passau blades. The general shape of the blade, fuller, and marks makes me think that it could be from the second part of the 16th century, or perhaps early 17th century. Some similar blades : https://www.antique-swords.com/AA96-...-Mortuary.html https://www.olympiaauctions.com/sale.../view-lot/118/ https://collection.maas.museum/object/249330 Anyway, I’m really happy about it! (And sorry for the not so good pictures, I'm preparing for moving out and don't have much space) Attached Images

9th June 2023, 02:12 PM	#2
Lee EAAF Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Upstate New York, USA Posts: 914	Very nice old warrior! Very nice! If you slap the flat of the blade against your thigh and find it 'springy' (that is, it vibrates for a moment) that would argue for it being the old European blade it certainly appears to be, rather than an antique local copy that would very quickly dampen out the vibration. Look for: Briggs, Lloyd Cabot, "European Blades in Tuareg Swords and Daggers," The Journal of the Arms & Armour Society [U.K.] Vol. V. No. 2. (1965), p. 37 - 92.

9th June 2023, 04:21 PM	#3
Yvain Member Join Date: May 2017 Location: France Posts: 178	The sandwiched ricasso dampens the vibrations a bit but the blade is springy and behaves correctly for a European piece. (I also don't think I ever saw a locally made takouba blade with this shape, but it could have happened indeed). I have the article you mention, I will have to search for it on my computer!

9th June 2023, 05:28 PM	#4
TVV Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Bay Area Posts: 1,625	Congratulations, looks like an old European blade indeed. The sandwich construction was used for older blades that had been remounted multiple times causing wear to the tang.

10th June 2023, 01:15 AM	#5
Yvain Member Join Date: May 2017 Location: France Posts: 178	Indeed TVV, I have another one like this. Though in this case I think the main goal could have been to lengthen the blade, as the "sandwich" part doesn't hide the beginning of the blade

10th June 2023, 04:23 PM	#6
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,952	I agree with the consensus here, this appears to be a European blade and has suffered the torments consistent with the Sahara, with these blades that came into this sphere through the 19th century through Mediterranean trade. These circulated for many generations and went through many alterations in their repeated remounting. The 'Passau' wolf seems well executed and consistent with the standard configurations typically used in Solingen work. The SAHAGUM was one of the many also consistent names etc. used spuriously in Solingen implying the work of makers in Toledo.It seems blades using this name were typically destined for North Europe, but obviously these like others often ended up in varying circumstances. The 'sandwiched' metal applied at the forte is a strengthening application commonly used in the Sahara for blades often remounted as Teodor notes, if I recall termed 'adabal'. The rebated point of the blade is also to tribal preference and in accord with the slashing cuts used by Tuareg tribesmen. The blade has fared well relatively with the markings as these were typically scoured often in sharpening using stones and such rugged methods. The new reddish rust may be from moisture arising in its location for a time especially if scabbarded. Its always hard to tell from photos but the metal seems otherwise unusually bright.

10th June 2023, 04:39 PM	#7
Marc M. Member Join Date: Aug 2019 Location: Belgium Posts: 164	Hi Yvain Nice takuba and a good european blade. Best to remove the active rust. Regards Marc