Question on British lance head, pattern 1846

[Kmaddock]

Hi
I just purchased a job lot of knives, bayonets kukuri etc
In the very mixed bag there was the attached lance head which I am not having much luck on identifying, there is surprisingly little on lance heads on the net.
Here is what I know
Length of head 5 inches, triangular, with 3 edges
Has 2 langets on either side, held on with screws, these langets are snapped off so I do not know original length.
No markings at all anywhere, shaft is solid wood.

From my studies ( all on line as I have no books on this subject)
I have added in a few informative lines about lances in my question below

It looks British but profile of tip is more pointed than the leaf type I have seen on line. Looks to be same proportions of model 1846 , Britain moved to solely socket type in 1868 and stuck these on with shellac

Also on the model 1846 the langets went onto the socket with no round edge where as on mine it is nicely rounded, I hope picture shows what I mean.

Shaft is solid wood not bamboo, 1866 was male bamboo, 1846 was solid ash.

Also has loop for attachment of a pennon, this is what you call a pendant on a lance seemingly.

If anyone has any idea as to what it is I would be very much appreciated.

If I am totally off in my pseudo identification I welcome correction.

Regards

Ken

[Jim McDougall]

Ken,
You may have a jackpot there!
This appears to be a French lance head, M1816, but could well be the M1823. They both had this type head, and long langets but the pennon attaching links were squared as yours....British did not have these.
It is a shame the langets are not intact as the only way to tell the difference is that the M1823 was asymmetrical , that is one was longer than the other...also the 1816 had the link closer together. There were three on both patterns.

Source, "French Military Weapons", Major James Hicks, 1964.

[Kmaddock]

Thanks Jim,
I appreciate the information. Pity about the langets been broken but looking at the platination the shaft breaking and the langets been broken off was a long long time ago. The cost of the item was minimal though so it does not matter, I was purchasing its accompanying pieces not the lance head.
There is surprising little on the net about lance heads, lot of information on snakes of this name though!
Kind regards
Ken

[Jim McDougall]

You bet Ken, and you're right, the paucity of information on lances is pretty sad, and on line is worse because no matter how you word the query, it wanders off to almost unimaginable tangents using the name or term lance.

Trying to find anything on French lances is impossible unless it is in the Napoleonic spectrum. It is as if the entire French military universe revolves around that period, and promptly went into a vacuum after Waterloo.

Actually, after Napoleon's defeat The Bourbon royalty was restored with Louis XVIII ruling, in 1823 France invaded Spain to restore Bourbon rule there. In 1830, the Bourbons were overthrown and Louis Philippe of the Orleans dynasty in place.
The lance had gained tremendous importance in the Napoleonic campaigns and in 1816, the British converted a number of their light cavalry units to lancers. Clearly not only was it a viable weapon, but influenced other countries as well, and remained in use into the 20th century.

I was always fascinated with lances, especially the British 17th Lancers at the Charge of the Light Brigade, Balaklava, 1854 and the Bengal Lancers in India. I recall winning a pair of British lances in a London auction about 40 years ago, intact and with pennons. I was in California, and had to drive about 50 miles to Los Angeles airport to pick them up at air freight. After some dialogue with customs I finally got them released...........but in my exuberance had forgotten one small detail........uh, I was driving a '69 Corvette..and these things were over 8 feet long!!!

I did not want to 'alter' them, so took out the T tops and off I went.......the charge of the Corvette lancers down the 401 freeway in pure glory! I almost made it home, when my good friends of the Highway Patrol, astonished, interrupted my gallantry. After a few chuckles (thankfully) they let me go.

While British lances are not overly rare, but many from India are, and I have had the pig sticking/pegging versions in degree.......anything French seems very unusual. It seems lances did not survive as much as other weapons, so I think what you have there is quite unique and worthy of more research.

Thanks for sharing it with us!!!

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

I dug out a few references to Lances both French and British... See https://www.google.com/search?q=Fren...Gnp4DmmBhxPMM:

Below the 1868 British weapon with pendant. and an earlier French lance head

[Jim McDougall]

Thanks Ibrahiim!!! Good illustrations, and the 1868 shown with pennon furled gives an idea of my 'Corvette charge"!! That was the model lances.

Here is the plate on British lances from "Sword, Lance and Bayonet", Hopkinson & Ffloulkes, 1938.

Since the net and general resources on lances is so lousy, every bit we can find and add is helpful.

On another forum, another 'my grandfather had this a found in attic..etc etc' post claimed a lance with the 'bulb' was French Napoleonic (of course), but by this chart was clearly the British M1820.

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

Salaams and thank you Jim !! The advent of Lances by the French was a most remarkable and simple arrangement by which the French could outreach British weapons in The Square and could reach their enemies who may have fallen to the ground and whilst prone could avoid cavalry borne swords could not escape the lance...This was generally looked at in bad taste but was eventually adopted as standard practice on all sides...See https://collections.royalarmouries.o...ative-563.html

French Lance
Blade length 214 mm
Country of manufacture France
Date entered service 1811
Overall length 2328 mm
Weight 1.672 kg

[Kmaddock]

Hi Jim and Ibrahiim,
Thanks for extra tit bits of information.
Image of traveling down the highway with lance brought a smile.

Reading a bit more on some sites I found the following bit of information
having langets on the lances was seen as an advantage as the heads could not be lopped off by a swords man
When the British model 1868 lance came out it was socket only which caused some consternation as experienced lancers felt that they could loose their lance heads in battle.
Another funny google when looking up the words lance and French is lance Armstrong and doping on the Tour de France 🇫🇷
Regards
Ken