Moro helmet

[Oliver Pinchot]

The Moro aesthetic is powerful, one which their helmets embody nicely.
This one ended recently on eBay:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Philippine-S...p2047675.l2557
What is known about Moro weapons craftsmen? Were there itinerant smiths, comprehensive workshops...? Was there a division between steel forgers and brass workers, wood carvers and so forth?

[Battara]

Interesting and rare helmet! (How did I miss this one? )

Yes there was a division of specialties from steel/blade workers, silver workers, brass workers, wood carvers, etc.

And as far as I know they were not itinerant, but did other things besides working on weapons. Not too different from what I saw for example in Fez, Morocco where there is still a division of specialties and expertise.

[Oliver Pinchot]

I missed it too, Jose.... if a member of the Forum got it, I hope they'll post it.

Interesting that Moro craftsmen produced a range of objects. True in most of North Africa too, as you say. The Ottomans and Persians were a good deal more specialized, in fact they were organized into guilds.

I've been looking at the earflaps-- are they on backward? They don't seem to fit the apertures quite right.

[estcrh]

Originally Posted by Oliver Pinchot

The Moro aesthetic is powerful, one which their helmets embody nicely.
This one ended recently on eBay:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Philippine-S...p2047675.l2557
What is known about Moro weapons craftsmen? Were there itinerant smiths, comprehensive workshops...? Was there a division between steel forgers and brass workers, wood carvers and so forth?

Oliver, thanks for posting this, there are not many images available of this type of helmet. The seller lost a lot of money by posting it in the "collectibles" category, it should have been listed as antique armor. If it is authentic the buyer got a great deal.

[A Senefelder]

From the pics this looks like a wonderfull example of the classic moro style helmet emulating European burgeonets. The inside pic is a touch fuzzy but from what I can see constructionally it is correct.

I've been looking at the earflaps-- are they on backward? They don't seem to fit the apertures quite right.

I believe they are on correctly. They have the same front/brim side set higher than the back/tail side seen in the European burgeonets which these sought to emulate http://www.myarmoury.com/albums/disp...278&fullsize=1 If you look at the 5th and 6th pictures in the auction you can see the curvature to the shape of the face that has been introduced into the cheek plates, if they were to be reversed the curved side for the contour of the back of the skull would be poking in twords the eyes which would be potentially dangerous. This is my personal opinion only based on the pictures available, looking forward to some one with more background on these Moro armour pieces to share their thoughts on it.

[CharlesS]

The opposite side of the helmet has some unusual damage, almost like puzzle pieces missing from its comb. I wonder how that type of damage could occur...almost looks like thay were punced out. Perhaps these were weaker areas of the forged brass??

[Sajen]

Originally Posted by CharlesS

The opposite side of the helmet has some unusual damage, almost like puzzle pieces missing from its comb. I wonder how that type of damage could occur...almost looks like thay were punced out. Perhaps these were weaker areas of the forged brass??

On the first picture you can see two old repairs at the ridge, maybe there has been a similar repair which break out again!?

[digenis]

Is it just me or does this helmet have a theatrical look to it?

[Andrew]

Originally Posted by digenis

Is it just me or does this helmet have a theatrical look to it?

It is just you.

[Oliver Pinchot]

Oh Andrew, I was going to say that.

Charles, the fractures look that way because the helmet is composed of brass-- although whether it is made up entirely of castings which have then been braised together, or is partially wrought, is not clear from the pics. In short, the fractures run along the boundaries of the microstructures in the metal:

[fernando]

I wouldn't mind concurring with digenis impression.
From a layman's point of view, this example looks much too stylized to be a faithful replica on an actual helmet model of the contextual period... ear protections giving it a 'composite' look and all that .
... notwithstanding this would be a master work ... as per experts around .

[digenis]

Google "Man from La Mancha"...

[Sajen]

Here an other example for comparison.

[Oliver Pinchot]

Despite its relative friability, I'm inclined to think brass made good helmets, since the Moro arsenal appears to have consisted largely, if not solely, of edged weapons. Had they, in addition, used percussive arms, clubs, maces, etc., this might not have been the case. There are two other known Moro helmet types; these are made of horn panels and brass mail (like the coats) or composed of a large number of pinned horn strips. I think the materials and structure of those fall into line with this argument as well. So, that alarming big hole and crumpling Charles is seeing on the comb of the helmet is a spot where it has been smashed, rather that cut, by something.

[Oliver Pinchot]

Incidentally, this is what Charles is referring to:

[CharlesS]

This is not the best angle for study, but this is a very similar, if not identical, helmet.

[Oliver Pinchot]

That's excellent, Charles.
The flaps on this helmet look like they're pointing opposite of the ones under discussion, to me. Anybody else seeing that?

I just found a reference to one of these that weighs over 6 lbs., it looks like Sajen's example. Seems like most, if not all, of this type is cast, then.

[David]

Originally Posted by digenis

Google "Man from La Mancha"…

I don't really get your point Digenis. The character in some versions of Man of La Mancha might in fact wear a similar shaped helmet since the character is Spanish and these Moro helmets are based on a Spanish form, the Moro having been occupied by the Spanish for so many years. If you mean to suggest that the helmet up for discussion is a stage prop i would think you are way off base.

[Andrew]

Originally Posted by digenis

Google "Man from La Mancha"...

How Quixotic of you.


It's the real-deal. However, I can understand how someone with little or no prior exposure to Moro helmets would think that.

[digenis]

I simply stated that the helmet in question looks somewhat theatrical. If the gentlemen commenting on my post took the the time to read what I wrote they would see that I never questioned the authenticity of the item. Nor did I claim any sort of expertise regarding Philippine weapons or armor. However, I stand by my original comment: The helmet is flamboyant and looks very similar to what has been used as a prop. in theatrical productions. That this is an apparently authentic example does not detract from the previous statement of fact.

[CharlesS]

Originally Posted by Oliver Pinchot

That's excellent, Charles.
The flaps on this helmet look like they're pointing opposite of the ones under discussion, to me. Anybody else seeing that?

I just found a reference to one of these that weighs over 6 lbs., it looks like Sajen's example. Seems like most, if not all, of this type is cast, then.

The way the ear flaps are situated now they are almost certainly clanging against the helmet. I wonder if they were removed, switched up incorrectly, or put on backwards at some point?

[spiral]

Both ear flaps from another helmet or later replacements perhaps? {As they would both seem to be slightly oversize not just reversed looking at the fit to the cut recesses?

That's judging from ebay pics.

spiral

[David]

Originally Posted by digenis

If the gentlemen commenting on my post took the the time to read what I wrote they would see that I never questioned the authenticity of the item. Nor did I claim any sort of expertise regarding Philippine weapons or armor. However, I stand by my original comment: The helmet is flamboyant and looks very similar to what has been used as a prop. in theatrical productions. That this is an apparently authentic example does not detract from the previous statement of fact.

Disgenis, i have indeed taken the time to read you posts. I then followed up with questions to inquire what you meant by your statements. If you have taken offense that was not my intention, however i don't appreciate your inference that i have not taken the time to read you. I can assure you that as a moderator on these forums i read posts very carefully. But you haven't really written much, have you, so it is not unusual that i might question your meaning.The helmet may look theatrical to you if you have no reference point to historical helmets of the type, either Moro or the European helmets on which they are based. Perhaps someone might recommend some good reading material for you on the subject.

[Andrew]

Originally Posted by digenis

I simply stated that the helmet in question looks somewhat theatrical. If the gentlemen commenting on my post took the the time to read what I wrote they would see that I never questioned the authenticity of the item. Nor did I claim any sort of expertise regarding Philippine weapons or armor. However, I stand by my original comment: The helmet is flamboyant and looks very similar to what has been used as a prop. in theatrical productions. That this is an apparently authentic example does not detract from the previous statement of fact.

digenis:

If I offended you, please accept my apologies. I was under the impression you were being playful with your La Mancha reference, and was attempting to be playful in return.

The helmet is no more "theatrical" than the myriad sword-like-objects used in productions like Romeo & Juliet, etc. To the uneducated eye, those props look "real." To the educated eye, they look like props.

Andrew

[Oliver Pinchot]

Here are three Moro armors. The first two should help contextualize the solid brass helmets a bit. The last pic is also brass, but made of mail and brass plates.

[Oliver Pinchot]

I agree with Charles, the earplates appear to hit the helmet when they pivot. I think they were reversed at some point-- it looks like they're only held on by a pin. They might be replacements, too.

[Oliver Pinchot]

This is a very unusual example of earlier Moro armor in a Spanish museum (unspecified, unfortunately.) It follows the lines of a Spanish burgonet and cuirass very closely. Both are made out of kerbau horn, with brass mounts on the helmet. The contrast between the dark, polished horn and burnished brass must have been striking.

[Jim McDougall]

From "Oriental Armour", H. Russell Robinson, 1967, p.124:
"...closer imitation of Spanish armour was achieved in the Moro brass helmets which were frequently cast in sections and joined together by brazing. The burgonet type helmets had the correct hinged cheekpieces, although a little shorter than the European originals, and not joined under the wearers chin".

The overall appearance of this example seems to lean toward the burgonet form rather than the more publicized combed morion seen in illustrations of Spanish conquistadors. The morion had the raised brim on front and back, and typically did not have cheekpieces as far as I have known.

Robinson also notes that although Spanish officers in the 16th century wore the morions aboard the ships apparently and the Moros must have seen many of them, but they did not have as much appeal as the burgonets, which were also present.

Regarding the 'theatrical' comments, I would point out that in many cases these anachronistic forms of armour used in the tribal regalia in many instances may seem quite so, and in many cases may appear humorous so jestful suggestions certainly should be taken as intended.
I can recall cases of studying similarly 'anachronistic' armour being worn by warriors in Bornu and Sudan with mail and helmets which were sometimes adorned with tableware such as forks and spoons. Obviously these could be seen humorously as well, but in the perception of the warriors these were status oriented items of Europeans they had encountered and were worn signifying that.

Oliver, thank you so much for posting this example, as well as the fascinating other examples. I knew little on these and its great to learn more on them!

[Battara]

Folks, this helmet in question is very common and typical in construction and style. Yes these were based on 16th century Spanish helmets of similar construction. As shown in the picture of the Maranao data warrior the had a section for a plume of flowers and vegetation which would make it even more "costume-ish" for American/European eyes. Remember though that in this region of the world flamboyance was not seen as a detriment. Similar flamboyance was seen all over Indonesia, at once time in Malaysia, as well as the Philippines. Variations in piercing and okir would be present, but the basic form would be the same.

I do agree that the ear flaps are on backwards. And by the way, the Maranaos were and are still known as great artisans in brass/bronze working. Some of this is still being made today in Marawi City in Maranao country.

This went for a steal - wish I had found it....

[fernando]

Perhaps we may conclude that 'theatrical' and 'flamboyant' are not so distant adjectives; which take us to conclude that the first was not so misplaced ... taken in the due context, of course.
After all, even the original examples where these helmets were replicated from, already had their touch of exhibitionism.
Oliver not minding, i am here attaching a few images of the original stuff for your perusal, presumptiously assuming that these are not so easy to find out there.
An woodcut of a European Captain of War (collection R. Daehnhardt) and a set of pictures of the period of Spanish King Philip II, both from the XVI century.

.