1st Post and 1st Keris

[JustYS]

Hello everyone,

Thank you for accepting me in this forum.

As the title said this is my first post and I would like to have your comments/feedbacks on my first Keris.

I’ve acquired this Keris recently, and these are the description from the seller:

Dhapur: Jalak Dinding

Pamor: Bonang Sarenteng = a string of bonang (musical instrument used in Gamelan)

Tangguh: Mataram Amangkurat (I believe it means 16-17th Century?)

PS: English is not my first language so I apologize in advanced for poor grammar/unclear message

Thank You

Best Regards,

YS

[David]

Hi YS and welcome to the forum.
It's a bit difficult to full assess you keris from these photos. Firstly photos are not the best way to assess any keris and in hand a different opinion might be formed. But you have not provided a good over all photos shot from directly above so it is possible to make some mistakes regarding dhapur. But what you were told might well be correct.
As far as tangguh is concerned, the first thing to know is that it is an estimated that you keris fits into a specific style that was known to be in fashion in a particular time period, but tangguh should never be taken as an indication of actual age. Old styles are sometimes copied at later dates to to place a blade on a timeline based upon a determined tangguh can be problematic. Unfortunately many of the indicators for judging tangguh cannot be drawn from a photograph alone and the blade really needs to be held and examined in person for a better assessment. My own thoughts here is that this blade is not nearly as old as you have been lead to believe.
This seems like a nice blade and the pamor seems fairly well executed. If it were mine the one thing i would do is to swap out that old mendak that is missing its stones with a nice quality new one. This blade deserves that.

[A. G. Maisey]

A very nice keris YS.

Amangkurat covers the period from approximately death of Sultan Agung through to establishment of Kartosuro, so in very broad terms 1645 to 1680, and running forward in time, not back. However, as David has pointed out, although a keris may be stylistically of some particular tangguh (classification), that does not necessarily mean that it can with any certainty be attributed to the time period referenced by that tangguh. It is usually not possible to be too definite about tangguh when using photos to judge.

Dhapur might be able to be given as Jalak Dinding, but again from a photo quite difficult to be certain, particularly with an older blade.

In any case, this is a really superior keris for a "first keris", really nice.

Apart from the missing stones, this mendak looks pretty good, probably silver I'd guess. I would not replace it, but repair it. If you are in Indonesia this should be easy for you to arrange, if not, well, we'll go another way.

[David]

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

Apart from the missing stones, this mendak looks pretty good, probably silver I'd guess. I would not replace it, but repair it. If you are in Indonesia this should be easy for you to arrange, if not, well, we'll go another way.

You make a good point Alan. The sliver looks in pretty good shape and this mendak would probably not be too difficult to repair.

[A. G. Maisey]

David, for the last few years it has been very, very difficult to obtain old mendak in Jawa. In fact, it has been difficult to obtain decent quality new mendak at reasonable prices, and granulated mendak seem to have disappeared altogether.

Probably 40 years ago Harjonegoro told me that there had only ever been one family in Central Jawa who were capable of doing acceptable granulation work, and that this family was now down to a father and one son, the father was elderly -- bear in mind, this was some time in the 1980's -- and there was some doubt that when he moved on the son would be able to continue work. Well it looks like the son did continue work -- or else the father moved on at a very advanced age -- because the supply of new, decent quality granulated mendak did continue for a good while. I wish I'd bought a few hundred when I could, because I have not been able to buy for years.

I'll be in Solo again shortly, and as usual I'll try to buy some decent mendak, again as usual, I expect not to be able to. High quality, silver, set with rose cut diamonds, or cubics, yes, I'll be able to buy those, but they make the total cost of a keris too expensive, so I'll pass. New, rubbish quality will also be available, but I will not waste money on those.

We need to retain and if possible, repair, the old ones.

[JustYS]

Thank you David and Alan for your feedbacks and suggestions

I will definitely follow your suggestion in replacing the mendak, although it has to wait till I go back to Jakarta where the Keris is located (I currently live in Perth).

I would also like to replace the warangka and hilt with sunggingan.

I requested the seller (who is a friend of mine) to find me an old/antique sunggingan that would fit this Keris, he owns an antique shop so I believe he has quite an extensive network in Indonesia to find me one.

Alas, he told me that it is already very difficult to find a new high quality sunggingan warangka, it would be extremely difficult to find an antique one.

I believe that I saw in one of the threads that both of you owned an antique sunggingan warangka.

Do you mind pointing me to the right direction where I can find one in Indonesia?

I don’t mind a new one as long as the quality is good (although I prefer old/antique one).

Some additional photos of the Keris:

[JustYS]

Now with the photos....😄

[JustYS]

Now with the photos...😀

[A. G. Maisey]

An antique sunggingan wrongko to fit your blade is totally out of the question.

A new sunggingan wrongko of very high quality will be difficult to find, and what you would need to do is to get the existing wrongko --- assuming it was made for the keris --- decorated.If the wrongko is not original to the blade you get a tukang wrongko to make a new wrongko , then get the decoration done.

It is not especially difficult to get sunggingan work of FAQ done, but I have not seen truly superb new work in 30 years.

Yes, I do have a small collection of vintage sunggingan wrongkos, I have one or two antique ones, and another small collection of very good quality new ones, that were done in the 1980's.

[David]

Originally Posted by JustYS

I would also like to replace the warangka and hilt with sunggingan.

While i appreciate good sunggingan dress i would like to suggest that you take a second look at the wrongko you currently have for this keris. Personally i find this wide diagonal kendit on this wrongko quite attractive. If it were mine i believe i would restore the mendak and leave the rest along.
Since you seem more interested in antique sunggingan why not seek out a keris already wearing such dress? I think you might be more likely to find antique sunggingan dress that is still with its keris than a good quality wrongko without a blade that you can refit well to your present keris blade.

[JustYS]

Thank you Alan, David for your feedbacks.

Based on your feedbacks I would probably do the following:

- Repair the mendak (must do)
- Keep the original warangka and maybe upgrade it with a good quality silver pendok (option 1)
- Get a new warangka that fitted the blade and decorate it (option 2)

[A. G. Maisey]

Talking about sunggingans YS, here is a thread that might interest you:-

http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...ght=sunggingan

[JustYS]

Yes indeed it was this thread you’re referring that inspired me to get a sunggingan warangka.....😄

My friend contacted me that he found someone that can make a new sunggingan warangka, from the samples he showed me it looks quite good.

I’ll let you know how it pans out.

Cheers,

YS