A cabasset for comments ... please

fernando · 19th February 2019, 06:22 PM

While i would date it from 1580-1600, i am ready to be corrected.
As i also dare to repute it as being authentic, with its 1247 grams weight, twelve brass rosettes and two holes in the back for the missing plume holder, a device not so often seen in this type. The armorers mark would identify it as Spanish ... well, apparently, when compared with Gyngells catalog and one similar example in the LONDON ARMY MUSEUM.
Having said all the above, i would like so much to read your folks comments, including those revealing i am wrong.
Dimensions: Height 21 cms. Width 18X22 cms. with Brims 23X28 cms.

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Jim McDougall · 20th February 2019, 01:38 AM

Actually I cannot see reason for expecting correction as this cabasset seems well identified and with comparable examples well presented as corroborating evidence. The armourers mark, though slightly indiscernible seems quite like that shown in the Gyngell reference as Spanish 16th c.

This type of morion helmet was well known in these times and into the 17th century across Europe and in England, termed the 'pear stalk' helmet for the curious projection at the peak of the almond shaped dome. As noted, these were well known in Spain, but in Portugal as well, and I recall research on a similar type helmet concerning the famed Rembrandt painting "The Man in the Golden Helmet". This painting was completed c. 1650-55, but as of recent findings, probably by one of his students rather than him.

Apparently, in Indian Goa, from 1550-80 there were five of these type helmets made in gilt repousse for the Vice royalty of Goa. One of these was captured and later taken to the Azores. It is believed that Rembrandt owned one of these gilt cabassets in his well known arms collection.

We can only speculate if this may have been the source for the theme of the 'golden helmet' painting. It does seem clear that artistic license is at play with the ear flaps added, which are of course a mid 17th c. feature from the lobster tail helmets.

Whatever the case, these are intriguing helmets, and the case of the missing Goa ones always comes to mind for me. Otherwise, these are considered well known common helmets in varying range of use.

fernando · 20th February 2019, 01:04 PM

Thank you for the reassuring words, Jim.
As a matter of fact, this cabasset comes from a rather reliable collector, whom i would not question; but apart from its authenticity, i wished to make it clear about the mark (thus origin), which was already my own inferrement, and towards some additional details hopefully provided by our fellow members.
Yo are right in that the "pear stalk" name came after these were of common use in Britain, apparently brought there by the Spaniards; but i fancy more the Cabasset attribution, for reasons connected with either my own and Spanish nomenclature. In principle brought from the Catalunian Cabasset, is based on Latin Capaceum, from Capere, meaning Contain, by conclusion "Protect" (one's head). Curiously still nowadays we here call a drivers protection helmet a "Capacete".
Good catch on the Vice-Roy "golden helmet", that we have discussed HERE. I just didn't divert into such beauties direction as i wished to (primarily) focus on the analysis of this one i am now presenting for comments.
It is of course only natural that these capacetes were not only Spanish but also Portuguese; an inevitable saga, due to both our Iberian proximity as also due to the fact that between 1580-1640 Portugal was under domain of the Spanish realm, which certainly increased cultural (and not only) influences.

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Jim McDougall · 20th February 2019, 04:13 PM

Interesting detail on the colloquial terms used for these helmets, and the etymology derivation. The 'pear stalk' term did indeed expand from the British and European versions later. It is interesting to me that these are a form of the familiar and almost cliche' 'combed morion'.

I noted the aside on the "Man in the Golden Helmet" because it is a brilliant example of these helmets and that while in effect, a common other ranks type, they did reach more illustrious character. The famed painting by Rembrandt certainly added a bit of mystique (the fact it was from his 'school' not his hand not withstanding) and dimension to the story of these helmets.

The armourers mark you have added certainly provides compelling evidence of the Spanish origin of this example, and the Gyngell reference has been venerably sound in the limited field of markings compendiums. It seems that most cases known of spurious use of these markings applies to sword blades and perhaps sometimes in guns....but it does not seem as much the case in armourers marks. Perhaps that is an assumption on my part with my being basically unfamiliar with armour in general?

These are the times I wish Mr. Senefelder would chime in!!

fernando · 21st February 2019, 03:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim McDougall

... These are the times I wish Mr. Senefelder would chime in!!

Unfortunately (mysteriously ?) A. Senefelder has ended his participation almost two years ago, not only in our forum but also in other venues, as i contextually noticed.
Pity there (apparently) is not a wider audience to assist and contribute to armour discussions ... for my regret

fernando · 23rd February 2019, 03:45 PM

A paper & copper essay for a plume holder. I will visit the (silver) smith workshop on Monday. Will ask them if the fixation rivets are better to be made of silver, a softer material, instead of iron, to not further damage the holes with the beating.
... Or maybe the whole thing in silver; exotic ... and hopefully not much expensive !

.

19th February 2019, 06:22 PM	#1
fernando (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,694	A cabasset for comments ... please While i would date it from 1580-1600, i am ready to be corrected. As i also dare to repute it as being authentic, with its 1247 grams weight, twelve brass rosettes and two holes in the back for the missing plume holder, a device not so often seen in this type. The armorers mark would identify it as Spanish ... well, apparently, when compared with Gyngells catalog and one similar example in the LONDON ARMY MUSEUM. Having said all the above, i would like so much to read your folks comments, including those revealing i am wrong. Dimensions: Height 21 cms. Width 18X22 cms. with Brims 23X28 cms. . Attached Images

20th February 2019, 01:38 AM	#2
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,941	Actually I cannot see reason for expecting correction as this cabasset seems well identified and with comparable examples well presented as corroborating evidence. The armourers mark, though slightly indiscernible seems quite like that shown in the Gyngell reference as Spanish 16th c. This type of morion helmet was well known in these times and into the 17th century across Europe and in England, termed the 'pear stalk' helmet for the curious projection at the peak of the almond shaped dome. As noted, these were well known in Spain, but in Portugal as well, and I recall research on a similar type helmet concerning the famed Rembrandt painting "The Man in the Golden Helmet". This painting was completed c. 1650-55, but as of recent findings, probably by one of his students rather than him. Apparently, in Indian Goa, from 1550-80 there were five of these type helmets made in gilt repousse for the Vice royalty of Goa. One of these was captured and later taken to the Azores. It is believed that Rembrandt owned one of these gilt cabassets in his well known arms collection. We can only speculate if this may have been the source for the theme of the 'golden helmet' painting. It does seem clear that artistic license is at play with the ear flaps added, which are of course a mid 17th c. feature from the lobster tail helmets. Whatever the case, these are intriguing helmets, and the case of the missing Goa ones always comes to mind for me. Otherwise, these are considered well known common helmets in varying range of use. Attached Images

20th February 2019, 01:04 PM	#3
fernando (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,694	Thank you for the reassuring words, Jim. As a matter of fact, this cabasset comes from a rather reliable collector, whom i would not question; but apart from its authenticity, i wished to make it clear about the mark (thus origin), which was already my own inferrement, and towards some additional details hopefully provided by our fellow members. Yo are right in that the "pear stalk" name came after these were of common use in Britain, apparently brought there by the Spaniards; but i fancy more the Cabasset attribution, for reasons connected with either my own and Spanish nomenclature. In principle brought from the Catalunian Cabasset, is based on Latin Capaceum, from Capere, meaning Contain, by conclusion "Protect" (one's head). Curiously still nowadays we here call a drivers protection helmet a "Capacete". Good catch on the Vice-Roy "golden helmet", that we have discussed HERE. I just didn't divert into such beauties direction as i wished to (primarily) focus on the analysis of this one i am now presenting for comments. It is of course only natural that these capacetes were not only Spanish but also Portuguese; an inevitable saga, due to both our Iberian proximity as also due to the fact that between 1580-1640 Portugal was under domain of the Spanish realm, which certainly increased cultural (and not only) influences. . Attached Images

23rd February 2019, 03:45 PM	#6
fernando (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,694	A paper & copper essay for a plume holder. I will visit the (silver) smith workshop on Monday. Will ask them if the fixation rivets are better to be made of silver, a softer material, instead of iron, to not further damage the holes with the beating. ... Or maybe the whole thing in silver; exotic ... and hopefully not much expensive ! . Attached Images

20th February 2019, 04:13 PM	#4
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,941	Interesting detail on the colloquial terms used for these helmets, and the etymology derivation. The 'pear stalk' term did indeed expand from the British and European versions later. It is interesting to me that these are a form of the familiar and almost cliche' 'combed morion'. I noted the aside on the "Man in the Golden Helmet" because it is a brilliant example of these helmets and that while in effect, a common other ranks type, they did reach more illustrious character. The famed painting by Rembrandt certainly added a bit of mystique (the fact it was from his 'school' not his hand not withstanding) and dimension to the story of these helmets. The armourers mark you have added certainly provides compelling evidence of the Spanish origin of this example, and the Gyngell reference has been venerably sound in the limited field of markings compendiums. It seems that most cases known of spurious use of these markings applies to sword blades and perhaps sometimes in guns....but it does not seem as much the case in armourers marks. Perhaps that is an assumption on my part with my being basically unfamiliar with armour in general? These are the times I wish Mr. Senefelder would chime in!!