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Old 13th December 2019, 10:27 AM   #1
ariel
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Default Need help with translation of a " blasphemous"(?) inscription

Sold on E-Bay.
This is an Ethiopian sword with straight blade 27 1/4" long, total 32".
Was advertised as Mamluk blade.
I was intrigued by the inscriptions and asked several colleagues , native Arabic, Farsi and Urdu speakers to translate the inscriptions.
First " Arabic" person told me that it was not in Arabic.
Farsi and Urdu were similarly rejected.
But then, one of those colleagues sent pics to her friend, a Saudi Arabian guy, who told her that the only thing he could translate was "Oh Muhammed", and the rest was " blasphemous". That piqued my interest even more.
Apologize for the pic of the entire sword: that was taken when it was already sold and the pics could not be adjusted.

Asking general opinions and Kwiatek's help with translation.
Many thanks.
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Old 13th December 2019, 12:06 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ariel
Sold on E-Bay.
This is an Ethiopian sword with straight blade 27 1/4" long, total 32".
Was advertised as Mamluk blade.
I was intrigued by the inscriptions and asked several colleagues , native Arabic, Farsi and Urdu speakers to translate the inscriptions.
First " Arabic" person told me that it was not in Arabic.
Farsi and Urdu were similarly rejected.
But then, one of those colleagues sent pics to her friend, a Saudi Arabian guy, who told her that the only thing he could translate was "Oh Muhammed", and the rest was " blasphemous". That piqued my interest even more.
Apologize for the pic of the entire sword: that was taken when it was already sold and the pics could not be adjusted.

Asking general opinions and Kwiatek's help with translation.
Many thanks.
It’s Arabic with lots of mistakes and done probably by a non-native speaker or by someone semi-literate.

“There’s no hero but ‘Ali, no sword but Dhu’l-Fiqar. ‘And tell the good tidings to the believers (Qur’an 61:13, in part).’ O Muhammad!”

The interesting bit is the difficult bit, of course. The last words are probably the maker’s or owner’s name. It’s spelled:

“Dhah-Kir al-Faranji”

Al-Faranji means “the European”. The first name is not an Arabic name. I can scout around to see if I can come up with anything
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Old 13th December 2019, 01:46 PM   #3
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Thanks.
A semi-literate European....
What a disappointment! I hoped it might be a Kharijite " blasphemy" :-(((
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Old 13th December 2019, 03:54 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ariel
Thanks.
A semi-literate European....
What a disappointment! I hoped it might be a Kharijite " blasphemy" :-(((
I’m not very knowledgeable on the subject but the reference to Ali might be Shiite which could be ”blasphemous” in the eyes of a Saudi (Sunni)?
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Old 13th December 2019, 04:45 PM   #5
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Regretfully it doesn't seem to be true: Ali is venerated by both branches.
One of the most popular saying of Muhammed is " There is no hero like Ali, no sword like Zulfikar". It is written on the majority of Islamic blades coming from all over, Sunni or Shia.
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Old 13th December 2019, 05:17 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ariel
Regretfully it doesn't seem to be true: Ali is venerated by both branches.
One of the most popular saying of Muhammed is " There is no hero like Ali, no sword like Zulfikar". It is written on the majority of Islamic blades coming from all over, Sunni or Shia.
But why? Ariel do you have an explanation about that?
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Old 13th December 2019, 05:26 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kwiatek
Al-Faranji means “the European”. The first name is not an Arabic name. I can scout around to see if I can come up with anything
Your translations are really cool, thanks!

Only one point, I think al faranji means the foreigner.
Of course most of the time Europeans.
The word comes from the Crusades, Franks, Faranj.
Also used Roumi, the foreigners and Christians, from the Byzantine or Easterm Roman Empire... Roumi=Romans...

So the foreigner might be an Ethiopian - Christian - but it's just my opinion...
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Old 13th December 2019, 07:34 PM   #8
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Arab countries Jews used the term 'faranji' to describe all things European, especially attire, accessories, manners.
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Old 13th December 2019, 08:19 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kubur
Your translations are really cool, thanks!

Only one point, I think al faranji means the foreigner.
Of course most of the time Europeans.
The word comes from the Crusades, Franks, Faranj.
Also used Roumi, the foreigners and Christians, from the Byzantine or Easterm Roman Empire... Roumi=Romans...

So the foreigner might be an Ethiopian - Christian - but it's just my opinion...
Were there Ethiopian Franks??? I think the Arabs have another word for Christian. I may be wrong but I thought Faranji would be Europeans. The meaning may have expanded to include all foreigners?
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Old 13th December 2019, 09:12 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Victrix
Were there Ethiopian Franks??? I think the Arabs have another word for Christian. I may be wrong but I thought Faranji would be Europeans. The meaning may have expanded to include all foreigners?

Have you ever heard about the myth of Prester John?

Yes you are right as I said Faranji were mainly Europeans but foreigners in general, this extended outside Arab lands up to India...

(Firangi sword)


Last edited by Kubur; 14th December 2019 at 08:44 AM.
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Old 14th December 2019, 01:10 AM   #11
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The other side of this blade with the fullers is also quite interesting, and certainly above what we typically coming from Sudan in terms of craftsmanship. The Mameluke attribution may be a bit of a leap, but it is certainly a nicer and potentially older blade. How old and from where I am not qualified to speculate.
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