Origine of Bugis Keris?

Athanase · 28th June 2018, 11:55 PM

Hello,

I am looking for the origin of this Keris. The scabbard is very similar to those I have from Sulawesi but it is not the original one that has been adapted for the blade... (I had never seen this method before)

The blade is unusual for me. I only once saw another similar old blade on the internet on a Bugis keris but I do not remember where.

The strangest on the blade is the Sogokan that seems to have been added afterwards but it seems old because this part is also eroded.
The handle is also quite different from what we see most often.

Thanks for your help.

David · 29th June 2018, 12:14 AM

I'm not so sure i see a Bugis blade when i look at this keris Athanase. What about it make you identify it as Bugis?

Athanase · 29th June 2018, 12:18 AM

I confess that I mainly based on the dress of the keris, but also on the solid and massive aspect of the blade.

Athanase · 29th June 2018, 12:25 AM

After reflection, the blade does not have the hexagonal section typical of keris Bugis but rather a rhombic section that would be more reminiscent of penisular keris.

Bjorn · 29th June 2018, 05:14 PM

My first instinct when I saw the blade was Sumatra, but I could be wrong.

Jean · 30th June 2018, 10:05 AM

Please see a quite similar blade (15 shallow luks, poorly carved sogokan, etc.) initially fitted on a Balinese kris! My guess about its origin is Sumbawa or Sumatra.
Regards

Jean · 30th June 2018, 10:44 AM

The hilt from Athanase has a more erect and compact shape than the pangulu rekko style hilts from Sulawesi, and looks like a mix of pangulu and Jawa demam style hilts. The origin of these hilts may be East Sumatra (see another specimen) or possibly Sumbawa.
Regards

Athanase · 30th June 2018, 11:57 AM

Thank you very much Jean.

So it's probably a Keris from Sumatra (maybe East Sumatra).

Jean · 30th June 2018, 04:23 PM

Hello Athanase,
This is my best guess but other opinions from Bugis/ Malay kris specialists are welcome as I was not sure myself about the origin of my kris and my hilt

Regards

A. G. Maisey · 30th June 2018, 08:18 PM

During the 1930's, and continuing after WWII, keris dealers from Central Jawa used to go to Bali to buy Balinese keris that could be reshaped into Javanese keris. They did this because good Javanese keris were becoming scarce and Balinese keris at that time were very cheap. Balinese keris were cheap because the Balinese had lost faith in the keris, and thus in the power of their Gods and Ancestors to assist in times of trouble. Their leaders had engaged in puputans (a Puputan is a "finishing") Balinese society was being reshaped by the Dutch. There was no place for the keris in Bali.

In Bali these dealers encountered a type of keris that they had not seen before, they called this keris "tangguh Kupang".

They did not know where it actually came from, except that Bali people knew that it came from somewhere off to the East, past Lombok.

This keris under discussion has about 90% agreement with what a Solo dealer of pre-1980 would call "Tangguh Kupang". It was called Tangguh Kupang, because all they knew about Kupang was that Kupang was off to the east somewhere too.

Jean · 1st July 2018, 09:10 AM

Thank you Alan for this precious information as usual!

Kupang is the capital city of West Timor where there is no kris tradition but who knows?
Regards

28th June 2018, 11:55 PM	#1
Athanase Member Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: Paris (France) Posts: 408	Origine of Bugis Keris? Hello, I am looking for the origin of this Keris. The scabbard is very similar to those I have from Sulawesi but it is not the original one that has been adapted for the blade... (I had never seen this method before) The blade is unusual for me. I only once saw another similar old blade on the internet on a Bugis keris but I do not remember where. The strangest on the blade is the Sogokan that seems to have been added afterwards but it seems old because this part is also eroded. The handle is also quite different from what we see most often. Thanks for your help. Attached Images

30th June 2018, 10:05 AM	#6
Jean Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,740	Please see a quite similar blade (15 shallow luks, poorly carved sogokan, etc.) initially fitted on a Balinese kris! My guess about its origin is Sumbawa or Sumatra. Regards Attached Images

30th June 2018, 10:44 AM	#7
Jean Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,740	The hilt from Athanase has a more erect and compact shape than the pangulu rekko style hilts from Sulawesi, and looks like a mix of pangulu and Jawa demam style hilts. The origin of these hilts may be East Sumatra (see another specimen) or possibly Sumbawa. Regards Attached Images Last edited by Jean; 1st July 2018 at 09:12 AM.

1st July 2018, 09:10 AM	#11
Jean Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,740	Thank you Alan for this precious information as usual! Kupang is the capital city of West Timor where there is no kris tradition but who knows? Regards Last edited by Jean; 1st July 2018 at 10:30 AM.

29th June 2018, 12:14 AM	#2
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,115	I'm not so sure i see a Bugis blade when i look at this keris Athanase. What about it make you identify it as Bugis?

29th June 2018, 12:18 AM	#3
Athanase Member Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: Paris (France) Posts: 408	I confess that I mainly based on the dress of the keris, but also on the solid and massive aspect of the blade.

29th June 2018, 12:25 AM	#4
Athanase Member Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: Paris (France) Posts: 408	After reflection, the blade does not have the hexagonal section typical of keris Bugis but rather a rhombic section that would be more reminiscent of penisular keris.

29th June 2018, 05:14 PM	#5
Bjorn Member Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Netherlands Posts: 188	My first instinct when I saw the blade was Sumatra, but I could be wrong.

30th June 2018, 11:57 AM	#8
Athanase Member Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: Paris (France) Posts: 408	Thank you very much Jean. So it's probably a Keris from Sumatra (maybe East Sumatra).

30th June 2018, 04:23 PM	#9
Jean Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,740	Hello Athanase, This is my best guess but other opinions from Bugis/ Malay kris specialists are welcome as I was not sure myself about the origin of my kris and my hilt Regards

30th June 2018, 08:18 PM	#10
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,884	During the 1930's, and continuing after WWII, keris dealers from Central Jawa used to go to Bali to buy Balinese keris that could be reshaped into Javanese keris. They did this because good Javanese keris were becoming scarce and Balinese keris at that time were very cheap. Balinese keris were cheap because the Balinese had lost faith in the keris, and thus in the power of their Gods and Ancestors to assist in times of trouble. Their leaders had engaged in puputans (a Puputan is a "finishing") Balinese society was being reshaped by the Dutch. There was no place for the keris in Bali. In Bali these dealers encountered a type of keris that they had not seen before, they called this keris "tangguh Kupang". They did not know where it actually came from, except that Bali people knew that it came from somewhere off to the East, past Lombok. This keris under discussion has about 90% agreement with what a Solo dealer of pre-1980 would call "Tangguh Kupang". It was called Tangguh Kupang, because all they knew about Kupang was that Kupang was off to the east somewhere too.