Turkish Kilij for translation.

Sylektis · 6th April 2015, 02:27 PM

Hi friends,
I would appreciate if someone could translate the inscription on this kilj.
Turkish silver-gilt with marks, Reign Of Mahmud II (1223-1255 A.H. Corresponding To 1808-39 A.D.) Your comments also are welcome.

TVV · 6th April 2015, 06:23 PM

While we are waiting for Zifir or someone else to translate the inscriptions, I just wanted to thank you for sharing this superb kilidj. The blade looks like it could be earlier than the fittings: have you tried etching a small window to test for wootz or a mechanical pattern?

Regards,
Teodor

Sylektis · 6th April 2015, 10:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TVV

have you tried etching a small window to test for wootz or a mechanical pattern?

Regards,
Teodor

No, Ι am afraid to do that. Furthermore already has sufficient corrosion thereon.

Battara · 7th April 2015, 12:49 AM

I agree that this is an early example. Also the hilt looks like it is made of rhino horn.

Nice kilij!

spiral · 17th April 2015, 12:30 AM

looks nice, a light etching would make sense to me... Just to see what it is made from...

Gavin Nugent · 17th April 2015, 03:06 PM

I too would leave this as is without an acid etch.
To etch a window would detract from the current fine old appeal.

Such a sword would more benefit from a professional polish if you wished to know the metal type and view it as new again, but as it sits, it is not required, it is a fine old sword of good quality.

Gavin

Rick · 17th April 2015, 05:11 PM

Is that a scarf weld I see where the blade widens ?
Strange place for a scarf weld .

David R · 17th April 2015, 08:15 PM

More likely where someone has had a little go with an etchant to see if it is wootz!

spiral · 17th April 2015, 11:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David R

More likely where someone has had a little go with an etchant to see if it is wootz!

Aint that the truth...LOL See...

linky.

Sylektis · 18th April 2015, 02:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spiral

Aint that the truth...LOL See...

linky.

Anyway, the seller did not describe it as wootz.
Sometimes when I look with a magnifying lens I see dark waves, but rather is what I would like to see...

Sylektis · 2nd May 2015, 04:03 PM

The Wallace Collection, exhibit Νο 1993. (Αnd one last attempt to find a translator...

ALEX · 5th May 2015, 02:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sylektis

The Wallace Collection, exhibit Νο 1993...

Was the workshop identified for the mentioned Wallace exhibit? If there are no marks, and seldomly they are on these examples, it can be any Ottoman workshop of that period. There were many. Your sword and Wallace's have many common features, and this is quite common design, so it could be the same shop or the next one down the road)

Roland_M · 5th May 2015, 11:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sylektis

No, Ι am afraid to do that. Furthermore already has sufficient corrosion thereon.

This is a wise decision. I am sure, this blade is made from wootz. But the lightest kind of etching can destroy the decorations. A few months ago I killed golden remains on my german small sword, without direct contact to the etchant, just a few bubbles. My heart is still bleeding.
I would leave it as it is and only stop the corrosion.

This fantastic dream of a blade is too good for experiments.

Kind regards Roland

ALEX · 6th May 2015, 09:41 AM

I'd etch the blade. if done properly, it would not damage anything. but could reveal wootz pattern the way it was intended. Gold can be protected with light coat of nail polish and removed with acetone after the etch, but this is not even necessary if light etchant is used, just make sure to clean it carefully, and neutralize the acid with baking soda solution right after. Cleaning and etching gold-inlaid wootz blades was/is a common practice, when necessary, it just has to be done properly. I think this one would benefit from it.

Sylektis · 30th September 2016, 01:30 PM

I just wonder if there is one, after so long, to translate it.
Thank you all, anyway.

mariusgmioc · 30th September 2016, 01:50 PM

Beautiful blade and most likely wootz. A good magnifying glass and a trained eye can identify wootz even without etchingin most cases. Anyhow,I believe the blade could greatly benefit from etching. If properly done, there wiĺl be no danger for the damascening.

Looking forward for the translation.

6th April 2015, 02:27 PM	#1
Sylektis Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 136	Turkish Kilij for translation. Hi friends, I would appreciate if someone could translate the inscription on this kilj. Turkish silver-gilt with marks, Reign Of Mahmud II (1223-1255 A.H. Corresponding To 1808-39 A.D.) Your comments also are welcome. Attached Images

2nd May 2015, 04:03 PM	#11
Sylektis Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 136	It could be the same workshop? The Wallace Collection, exhibit Νο 1993. (Αnd one last attempt to find a translator... Attached Images

6th April 2015, 06:23 PM	#2
TVV Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Bay Area Posts: 1,624	While we are waiting for Zifir or someone else to translate the inscriptions, I just wanted to thank you for sharing this superb kilidj. The blade looks like it could be earlier than the fittings: have you tried etching a small window to test for wootz or a mechanical pattern? Regards, Teodor

7th April 2015, 12:49 AM	#4
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,221	I agree that this is an early example. Also the hilt looks like it is made of rhino horn. Nice kilij!

17th April 2015, 12:30 AM	#5
spiral Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,712	looks nice, a light etching would make sense to me... Just to see what it is made from...

17th April 2015, 03:06 PM	#6
Gavin Nugent Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 2,818	I too would leave this as is without an acid etch. To etch a window would detract from the current fine old appeal. Such a sword would more benefit from a professional polish if you wished to know the metal type and view it as new again, but as it sits, it is not required, it is a fine old sword of good quality. Gavin

17th April 2015, 05:11 PM	#7
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,293	Is that a scarf weld I see where the blade widens ? Strange place for a scarf weld .

17th April 2015, 08:15 PM	#8
David R Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Posts: 1,079	More likely where someone has had a little go with an etchant to see if it is wootz!

6th May 2015, 09:41 AM	#14
ALEX Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 936	I'd etch the blade. if done properly, it would not damage anything. but could reveal wootz pattern the way it was intended. Gold can be protected with light coat of nail polish and removed with acetone after the etch, but this is not even necessary if light etchant is used, just make sure to clean it carefully, and neutralize the acid with baking soda solution right after. Cleaning and etching gold-inlaid wootz blades was/is a common practice, when necessary, it just has to be done properly. I think this one would benefit from it.

30th September 2016, 01:30 PM	#15
Sylektis Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 136	I just wonder if there is one, after so long, to translate it. Thank you all, anyway.

30th September 2016, 01:50 PM	#16
mariusgmioc Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Location: Austria Posts: 1,903	Beautiful blade and most likely wootz. A good magnifying glass and a trained eye can identify wootz even without etchingin most cases. Anyhow,I believe the blade could greatly benefit from etching. If properly done, there wiĺl be no danger for the damascening. Looking forward for the translation.