New Balinese Kersi got

HughChen · 5th September 2024, 05:37 PM

After learning in the forum for so long, I decided to buy something oversea. And I got them from an auction today (haven't reveived), how do you think of it?

HughChen · 5th September 2024, 05:40 PM

I got two Keris and several hilts

milandro · 6th September 2024, 08:16 AM

they both seem to be old blades.

The first one is in a Bali Sarong but is not a Balinese blade (looks Sumatran to my eye but I may be wrong), Pamor looks nice, the ganja seems to be tilted therefore probably detached.

The second one has a nice , bone(?) Madurese hilt, the blade may be a Madurese one too.

The pamor is not really very evident from the pictures.

I don't know where you are in the world (China?) but replacing sarongs to fit the blades may prove a complicated task.

HughChen · 6th September 2024, 09:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by milandro

they both seem to be old blades.

The first one is in a Bali Sarong but is not a Balinese blade (looks Sumatran to my eye but I may be wrong), Pamor looks nice, the ganja seems to be tilted therefore probably detached.

The second one has a nice , bone(?) Madurese hilt, the blade may be a Madurese one too.

The pamor is not really very evident from the pictures.

I don't know where you are in the world (China?) but replacing sarongs to fit the blades may prove a complicated task.

Yes, we don't have specialist in making Kris swords and accessories here in China. Maybe the forum can teach us how to DIY. Even if we can't do it by ourselves, we can also ask a regular carpenter to do it for us.

milandro · 6th September 2024, 10:39 AM

I'd be very cautious in doing DIY things, not only because it isn't easy but also because the whole point is to do things in the correct way if you have to do that at all!

Even if (and I've done so a couple of times) you commission these dresses in Indonesia of course an artisan in Bali or Madura may have an interpretation of a kris made in a different tradition that ends up being incorrect. The same goes for any other part of the kris.

There are tutorial videos on YouTube but again, I would be VERY careful that the person that you may commission this in China would not only understand what to do but also would do it matching correctly a blade from Bali to a Balinese dress and hilt and ring or a Sumatran Kris to a Sumatran dress and attributes.

The best thing to do is to buy things which are not in need of any replacement.

Restorations too can be a fool's errand if you don't know what you are doing.
There is the case of this famous young guy Alec Steele who bought a kris on line (incomplete) and proceeded to " restore" the thing.

It was a complete pointless thing. The kris (which he said was ancient , 15th century, or so he was told

) had no ganja to start with (and finish) then he made an hilt (resembling a sajen kris) which he glued to the kris (!) he put no mendak there....

Be also very careful if you are entertaining the thought of staining your blades.

A. G. Maisey · 7th September 2024, 10:41 PM

A long time ago, like 70 years ago & more, I had the idea in my head that I wanted to get every keris ever made. Yeah, silly, I know, but I was only a little kid & I knew next to nothing. But anyway, what I did manage to do was buy every keris I came across, provided I didn't need to rob a bank to get the cash --- yeah, banks used to keep cash behind the counter back in the dark ages. I bought keris & all things related to keris. A lot of the keris I bought did not have scabbards. There was a lot more keris & other edged weapons floating around in pawn shops & auctions & antique shops back in the 1950's & 1960's in Australia than there are now.

If we have an example to follow, it is not a real difficult job to carve a gayaman or sandang walikat scabbard, & it is an easy job to make a gandar. If we already have the atasan --- top part of the scabbard --- it is not difficult to fit it to a different blade to the one that it was made for.

These are not difficult jobs, but they are tedious and you do need to be able to handle tools.

The work I have done in making, repairing & fitting scabbards for blades is not up to the standard of the craftsmen in Jawa & Bali & other places who do this for a living, but it is for the most part better than fair, & for maybe the last 40 years it is indistinguishable from work done in Indonesia. But it takes me about ten times as long as it takes a working tukang wrongko.

Restoration of blades is not at all difficult, but this is something that you need training for. Simple stuff like cleaning up edges, making a new gonjo, I think most people with some tools skill can handle that, staining takes time to learn, everything else you need training for.

I would encourage people to not be afraid to try. Start on little things, work carefully, work slowly, do the research. If one does not live in Indonesia or visit regularly, it can be quite difficult to get decent restoration work done, & I believe that for most people, it is not such a difficult thing to learn how to do things oneself.

5th September 2024, 05:37 PM	#1
HughChen Member Join Date: Aug 2024 Location: China Posts: 119	New Balinese Kersi got After learning in the forum for so long, I decided to buy something oversea. And I got them from an auction today (haven't reveived), how do you think of it? Attached Images

5th September 2024, 05:40 PM	#2
HughChen Member Join Date: Aug 2024 Location: China Posts: 119	One more I got two Keris and several hilts Attached Images

6th September 2024, 08:16 AM	#3
milandro Member Join Date: Jan 2022 Location: Netherlands Posts: 462	they both seem to be old blades. The first one is in a Bali Sarong but is not a Balinese blade (looks Sumatran to my eye but I may be wrong), Pamor looks nice, the ganja seems to be tilted therefore probably detached. The second one has a nice , bone(?) Madurese hilt, the blade may be a Madurese one too. The pamor is not really very evident from the pictures. I don't know where you are in the world (China?) but replacing sarongs to fit the blades may prove a complicated task.

6th September 2024, 10:39 AM	#5
milandro Member Join Date: Jan 2022 Location: Netherlands Posts: 462	I'd be very cautious in doing DIY things, not only because it isn't easy but also because the whole point is to do things in the correct way if you have to do that at all! Even if (and I've done so a couple of times) you commission these dresses in Indonesia of course an artisan in Bali or Madura may have an interpretation of a kris made in a different tradition that ends up being incorrect. The same goes for any other part of the kris. There are tutorial videos on YouTube but again, I would be VERY careful that the person that you may commission this in China would not only understand what to do but also would do it matching correctly a blade from Bali to a Balinese dress and hilt and ring or a Sumatran Kris to a Sumatran dress and attributes. The best thing to do is to buy things which are not in need of any replacement. Restorations too can be a fool's errand if you don't know what you are doing. There is the case of this famous young guy Alec Steele who bought a kris on line (incomplete) and proceeded to " restore" the thing. It was a complete pointless thing. The kris (which he said was ancient , 15th century, or so he was told ) had no ganja to start with (and finish) then he made an hilt (resembling a sajen kris) which he glued to the kris (!) he put no mendak there.... Be also very careful if you are entertaining the thought of staining your blades.

7th September 2024, 10:41 PM	#6
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,858	A long time ago, like 70 years ago & more, I had the idea in my head that I wanted to get every keris ever made. Yeah, silly, I know, but I was only a little kid & I knew next to nothing. But anyway, what I did manage to do was buy every keris I came across, provided I didn't need to rob a bank to get the cash --- yeah, banks used to keep cash behind the counter back in the dark ages. I bought keris & all things related to keris. A lot of the keris I bought did not have scabbards. There was a lot more keris & other edged weapons floating around in pawn shops & auctions & antique shops back in the 1950's & 1960's in Australia than there are now. If we have an example to follow, it is not a real difficult job to carve a gayaman or sandang walikat scabbard, & it is an easy job to make a gandar. If we already have the atasan --- top part of the scabbard --- it is not difficult to fit it to a different blade to the one that it was made for. These are not difficult jobs, but they are tedious and you do need to be able to handle tools. The work I have done in making, repairing & fitting scabbards for blades is not up to the standard of the craftsmen in Jawa & Bali & other places who do this for a living, but it is for the most part better than fair, & for maybe the last 40 years it is indistinguishable from work done in Indonesia. But it takes me about ten times as long as it takes a working tukang wrongko. Restoration of blades is not at all difficult, but this is something that you need training for. Simple stuff like cleaning up edges, making a new gonjo, I think most people with some tools skill can handle that, staining takes time to learn, everything else you need training for. I would encourage people to not be afraid to try. Start on little things, work carefully, work slowly, do the research. If one does not live in Indonesia or visit regularly, it can be quite difficult to get decent restoration work done, & I believe that for most people, it is not such a difficult thing to learn how to do things oneself.