Inscription on tulwar help!

[AkaaliSingh]

Hi all , here is a gold indian tulwar i own with a persian blade.. can anyone through more light to this sword? I also need help with the inscription that is on the blade. Can anybody help with the translation please?

thank you!

[Battara]

Looks like the inscriptions were once gold inlaid.

Perhaps it's the lighting, but the blade either has lost its etch or it is more Indian wootz than Persian.

I love the condition of the hilt! Rare to have more than 95% of the koftgari!

[mariusgmioc]

Originally Posted by AkaaliSingh

Hi all , here is a gold indian tulwar i own with a persian blade.. can anyone through more light to this sword? I also need help with the inscription that is on the blade. Can anybody help with the translation please?

thank you!

This looks like a typical Persian Shamshir wootz blade with a new Tulwar hilt.

Can you see any wootz watering anywhere on the blade? This would be very important because this type of blade, with this type of inscription if it is genuine, it must be wootz. If it is not wootz, then I suspect a fake.

Have you considered etching it?

I wouldn't be surprised if the marking reads "Assad Allah" or "Kalb Ali."

PS: I can bet the gold koftgari on the hilt, or the whole hilt itself, is recent production (koftgari is very sensitive and there is no way it can last practically intact on the hilt of a functional sword). I have seen recent Indian Tulwars with almost identical hilts, and I have seen some with PAINTED "koftagari" that look suspiciously similar to yours.

Just check out this link at another thread on this site and you will get a better idea of what I mean:

http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=3168

[AJ1356]

The top one read Nasr u menAllah wa fathun qarib. and the second one reads, Tawakal tu 'alAllah.
The blade looks to be form 1700's or later, from anywhere west of India can't say for sure. However it is common to find shamshir blades with later talwar hilts.

[ariel]

I am sure that the handle, while newer than the blade, is not new in absolute terms. Just exceptionally well -preserved. 19 cen the latest.

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

Originally Posted by AkaaliSingh

Hi all , here is a gold indian tulwar i own with a persian blade.. can anyone through more light to this sword? I also need help with the inscription that is on the blade. Can anybody help with the translation please?

thank you!

Salaams AkaaliSingh This is an interesting blade although it appears to have attracted some doubt as to originality but that is a very difficult task to perform on a photograph ...nevertheless it is interesting from that viewpoint...and discussion about originality aren't all bad..
From my perspective I am interested in the Talismanic square used to decorate this blade and the other inscriptions noting the dotted style in application. I see that the inscription was inlaid with gold and that this has mostly worn off. Perhaps gold work has been applied/reapplied to the hilt and then an older blade has been matched?
Regards,
Ibrahiim al Balooshi.

[mariusgmioc]

Originally Posted by Ibrahiim al Balooshi

Salaams AkaaliSingh This is an interesting blade although it appears to have attracted some doubt as to originality but that is a very difficult task to perform on a photograph ...nevertheless it is interesting from that viewpoint...and discussion about originality aren't all bad..
From my perspective I am interested in the Talismanic square used to decorate this blade and the other inscriptions noting the dotted style in application. I see that the inscription was inlaid with gold and that this has mostly worn off. Perhaps gold work has been applied/reapplied to the hilt and then an older blade has been matched?
Regards,
Ibrahiim al Balooshi.

Hello Ibrahiim,

The inscription was ORIGINALLY inlaid in gold, as the dotted traces that we see now served to fix the gold wire that was applied thereto. This is one of the classic forms of damascening.

Both the style of the cartouches and the technique seem to be typically Persian to me.

The talismanic square usually contained different combinations of numbers as you can see in the book "Arms and Armor from Iran" by Mr. Moshtagh Khorasani (page 148).

[mariusgmioc]

Originally Posted by ariel

I am sure that the handle, while newer than the blade, is not new in absolute terms. Just exceptionally well -preserved. 19 cen the latest.

Maybe you are right, and I hope you are, but I suggest you read the thread I posted recently about fake Koftgari.

[estcrh]

Originally Posted by mariusgmioc

Maybe you are right, and I hope you are, but I suggest you read the thread I posted recently about fake Koftgari.

Very interesting info on new koftgari, it really makes me wonder about this hilt.