Help! I really could use your help in identifying this arabian(?) dagger

vman1974 · 21st September 2005, 04:35 PM

Fellow blade enthusiasts. Thank you for allowing me to participate in your forum.

I am in need of information on the following dagger I purchased from a customer. I feel it is old as I know for a fact that it has spent a good number of years in a trunk with quilts.

I bought it along with a very ornate solid brass powder horn.

Thanks in advance for your help in this matter. I am

Vman
vester@alltel.net

Tim Simmons · 21st September 2005, 05:00 PM

Hi , welcome to this great forum, I would say it is probably the most active one to join, with the most wonderfully diverse and informed opinions given with pleasure. Your knife is, I am sure from Morocco and although the pictures are not the best I think it is clear that your knife is a very late 20th century tourist product. I hope this is not to disappointing. Stick around and look through the archive and learn more. Tim

Rick · 21st September 2005, 06:01 PM

Hi Vman and welcome .
It is hard to tell the quality of this Koummya (sp?) from the pictures you have provided . Can you provide better pictures ? A close up of the blade and hilt perhaps .
The real indication of the quality of your piece is best judged by the blade .
This looks a first glance like it may be a fairly decent example ; I find the lack of fancy decoration encouraging in this regard .
What is the handle material ?

vman1974 · 21st September 2005, 07:23 PM

I am totally blown away by this forum. The willingness to help is amazing?
I appreciate any and all information you can give me. Here are some scanned pics, hopefully they are of better quality. be sure to ask for any other pics you need.

Rick · 21st September 2005, 07:33 PM

I think this one is a little earlier than Tim's late 20c. estimate . The engraving looks only so so in quality from what I can see . That does not mean it's not a worthy piece as not everyone can afford the best in any society .
I ask again what is the handle material , also how thick (not wide) is the blade and lastly is it sharpened ?

vman1974 · 21st September 2005, 07:43 PM

Sorry for the mix-up. The handle is mainly wood. with a brass plate on the pommel. The handle THICKNESS (

) is ~1 1/16inches or (for you european chaps) ~2.8cm.

I cannot express enough my awe at the quik responses to my inquiry.

Here are the questions everyone ask - What is it's worth, exactly WHAT IS IT, and when was it made?

Thanks,
Vman

vman1974 · 21st September 2005, 07:47 PM

The knife does have the original edge except for the back where some idiot touced it to a grinder. I'd like to ring his neck. I'll post the horrific pic.

Tim Simmons · 21st September 2005, 07:51 PM

Very later 20th century might have been a little dambing. Good luck with the shop Vester. Tim

vman1974 · 21st September 2005, 07:54 PM

idiot's marks

Tim Simmons · 21st September 2005, 08:00 PM

Once bitten twice shy

Tim

Rick · 21st September 2005, 08:03 PM

Hi Vester , I guess in trying to clarify thickness I actually created confusion .

I was referring to the stock the blade is made of i.e. when you look at a coin or piece of metal edge on .

Our forum policy is that we do not give estimates of value for items presented for discussion .

You can always get a rough idea of value from ebay sold listings .

Rick · 21st September 2005, 08:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vman1974

idiot's marks

Arrgh !!

Looks like it's going to be a restoration project .

vman1974 · 21st September 2005, 08:10 PM

Rick, can you then tell me what it is and etimate when it was made?

I am used to restoring old knives, what should I do where that idiot dabled or should I sell it as is.

Vester

vman1974 · 21st September 2005, 08:20 PM

Rick, you must look over my thick headedness. The blade is 2mm thick and 22.5cm long. It is, the best I can tell, high carbon steel.

Vester

Rick · 21st September 2005, 08:33 PM

That's what it's called . It's Morroccan in origin .

Now the quality of this piece lies in the blade ; if it is made from stout stock , tightly mounted to the handle , and the unground side of the blade is 'sharp' not rebated it might be a decent everyday example .

If it is unsharpened it is more likely to be a souvenir quality dagger .

I would guess it to be at the oldest late 19th to mid 20thC ; you may be able to determine this from the source you bought it from i.e. some Granny's attic etc.
I'll guess it at about WWII .
There are tons of these around some quite good some average and some cruddy junk made for "One who travels for pleasure"

In my opinion any good quality blade is worth restoring .
If it's schlock then just unload it .

In the end you will have to decide the quality because , of course, it's in your possesion .

As a side note regarding the engraving ; I have a very old Nimcha (from Algeria most likely) which has a 17th century English backsword blade and a massive Rhino horn hilt that has only average quality engraving on its hilt ring .
http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...ghlight=nimcha

21st September 2005, 04:35 PM	#1
vman1974 Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 7	Help! I really could use your help in identifying this arabian(?) dagger Fellow blade enthusiasts. Thank you for allowing me to participate in your forum. I am in need of information on the following dagger I purchased from a customer. I feel it is old as I know for a fact that it has spent a good number of years in a trunk with quilts. I bought it along with a very ornate solid brass powder horn. Thanks in advance for your help in this matter. I am Vman vester@alltel.net Attached Images

21st September 2005, 07:23 PM	#4
vman1974 Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 7	thanks Rick, here are hopefully better pics I am totally blown away by this forum. The willingness to help is amazing? I appreciate any and all information you can give me. Here are some scanned pics, hopefully they are of better quality. be sure to ask for any other pics you need. Attached Images

21st September 2005, 07:43 PM	#6
vman1974 Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 7	attn:Rick Sorry for the mix-up. The handle is mainly wood. with a brass plate on the pommel. The handle THICKNESS ( ) is ~1 1/16inches or (for you european chaps) ~2.8cm. I cannot express enough my awe at the quik responses to my inquiry. Here are the questions everyone ask - What is it's worth, exactly WHAT IS IT, and when was it made? Thanks, Vman

21st September 2005, 07:47 PM	#7
vman1974 Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 7	one other thing... The knife does have the original edge except for the back where some idiot touced it to a grinder. I'd like to ring his neck. I'll post the horrific pic.

21st September 2005, 07:54 PM	#9
vman1974 Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 7	idiot's marks Attached Images

21st September 2005, 05:00 PM	#2
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,776	Hi , welcome to this great forum, I would say it is probably the most active one to join, with the most wonderfully diverse and informed opinions given with pleasure. Your knife is, I am sure from Morocco and although the pictures are not the best I think it is clear that your knife is a very late 20th century tourist product. I hope this is not to disappointing. Stick around and look through the archive and learn more. Tim

21st September 2005, 06:01 PM	#3
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,287	Hi Vman and welcome . It is hard to tell the quality of this Koummya (sp?) from the pictures you have provided . Can you provide better pictures ? A close up of the blade and hilt perhaps . The real indication of the quality of your piece is best judged by the blade . This looks a first glance like it may be a fairly decent example ; I find the lack of fancy decoration encouraging in this regard . What is the handle material ?

21st September 2005, 07:33 PM	#5
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,287	I think this one is a little earlier than Tim's late 20c. estimate . The engraving looks only so so in quality from what I can see . That does not mean it's not a worthy piece as not everyone can afford the best in any society . I ask again what is the handle material , also how thick (not wide) is the blade and lastly is it sharpened ?

21st September 2005, 07:51 PM	#8
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,776	Very later 20th century might have been a little dambing. Good luck with the shop Vester. Tim

21st September 2005, 08:00 PM	#10
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,776	Once bitten twice shy Tim

21st September 2005, 08:03 PM	#11
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,287	Hi Vester , I guess in trying to clarify thickness I actually created confusion . I was referring to the stock the blade is made of i.e. when you look at a coin or piece of metal edge on . Our forum policy is that we do not give estimates of value for items presented for discussion . You can always get a rough idea of value from ebay sold listings .

21st September 2005, 08:10 PM	#13
vman1974 Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 7	me again rick Rick, can you then tell me what it is and etimate when it was made? I am used to restoring old knives, what should I do where that idiot dabled or should I sell it as is. Vester

21st September 2005, 08:20 PM	#14
vman1974 Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 7	blade thickness Rick, you must look over my thick headedness. The blade is 2mm thick and 22.5cm long. It is, the best I can tell, high carbon steel. Vester

21st September 2005, 08:33 PM	#15
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,287	Koummya That's what it's called . It's Morroccan in origin . Now the quality of this piece lies in the blade ; if it is made from stout stock , tightly mounted to the handle , and the unground side of the blade is 'sharp' not rebated it might be a decent everyday example . If it is unsharpened it is more likely to be a souvenir quality dagger . I would guess it to be at the oldest late 19th to mid 20thC ; you may be able to determine this from the source you bought it from i.e. some Granny's attic etc. I'll guess it at about WWII . There are tons of these around some quite good some average and some cruddy junk made for "One who travels for pleasure" In my opinion any good quality blade is worth restoring . If it's schlock then just unload it . In the end you will have to decide the quality because , of course, it's in your possesion . As a side note regarding the engraving ; I have a very old Nimcha (from Algeria most likely) which has a 17th century English backsword blade and a massive Rhino horn hilt that has only average quality engraving on its hilt ring . http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...ghlight=nimcha