Translation help, please

Spunjer · 23rd August 2008, 12:49 PM

this was Datu Uto's flag, a Maguindanaon datu. one of the last powerful datus to resist against the spaniards.
here he is pictured sitting next to the future president taft.

i was wondering is someone can help me translate the writings on this flag

btw, as i was inspecting this flag, i noticed these stains.

here's the close up of how the lettering was produced:

thanks in advance!

Flavio · 23rd August 2008, 01:08 PM

I can't help with traslation, but I can say that this is REALLY FASCINATING!!!!

Spunjer · 23rd August 2008, 02:04 PM

yes indeedy, flavio. at first i thought it was a small flag. when it was laid out in front of me, i was surprise to see it was about 5ft by 10 ft or so.

Flavio · 23rd August 2008, 03:14 PM

Do you think that the stains can be blood.....?

Spunjer · 24th August 2008, 02:31 AM

it kinda looks it, but then again, it could just be grease. i guess unless it's subjected to a CSI type test, we may never know.

Rick · 24th August 2008, 03:43 AM

Try a bit of hydrogen peroxide on an area; if the stain disappears it may well be blood .

Spunjer · 24th August 2008, 12:51 PM

hi rick,
the flag actually belongs to a museum which i was fortunate enough to be given access to take a close up picture of.

Rick · 24th August 2008, 03:36 PM

Well, so much for that idea .

sipakatuo · 24th August 2008, 03:47 PM

It's written in an Arabic language.
'Laa ilahailallah Muhammad rasulallah fatu ala aliallah bi huwa inni fanuj saraf shulton Muhammad salim. As kinalu qudrattillah faharuddin.'

Translation in English :

'There is no God but Allah and Muhmammad is the prophet, victory is destine by Allah and so saviour to Muhammad's followers.'

Translation in Indonesia :

'Tiada Tuhan selain Allah dan Muhammad adalah utusan Allah, kemenangan adalah atas kehendak Allah SWT dan keselamatan bagi para pengikut Muhammad SAW.'

I hope it helps...

sipakatuo · 24th August 2008, 03:51 PM

One of muslim stronghold in Phillippine since ages ago...

Dom · 24th August 2008, 05:08 PM

Hi Spunjer

just a "try" because, it's not in clear Arabic language
but may be that will give ideas to some Man of Letters

I put a translation, or what seems to us, straight on the pic
as it's a mix between arab/occidental writting, and english

here what "should be "the sense" of those sentences
Allah, there's only one God and Muhammed
is his Messenger, « faitoo » ( ?) on (upon) Ali
Allah ?????????????????????? Ashraf
Sultan Mohammed ???????? Skandar ????
God respecting him for his pride of the religion

Ashraf, Skandar should be names, but to be confirmed

sorry, to don't be better

à +

Dom

Battara · 24th August 2008, 08:30 PM

What a fantastic piece of history. Thanks for sharing it here with us!

I'm going to have to visit this musuem - seen it on internet, but they must have more than they show!!!!

BTW - Skandar is another name for Alexander.......

Spunger, would you show us a picture of the entire flag?

Once read a history of Datu Uto. Once strong enough to be a Sultan!

Spunjer · 25th August 2008, 03:22 AM

Sipakatuo and Dom,
thank you! any information i can get is really a big help! i'm assuming some of the words are in maguindanaon. the translation that was added to this flag's description in the museum's records, i felt was incomplete.

Battara, actually that's all that was on the flag. the second picture is the most complete one i got, lol. i had to stand on a chair and raise the camera just to get that image

Battara · 25th August 2008, 02:40 PM

W

W! So how big is this puppy?

Spunjer · 25th August 2008, 02:42 PM

lol, it was huge. guesstimating around 5x10 feet but i think it was bigger. we had to put four long tables together so we can decently spread the flag.
here's a better view of the flag:

Flavio · 26th August 2008, 09:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spunjer

it kinda looks it, but then again, it could just be grease. i guess unless it's subjected to a CSI type test, we may never know.

Spunjer, if the flag belongs to a museum I think they can ask a collaboration with police for a CSI analysis to see if the stains are blood... Here in italy sometimes the museums ask the police for some particular analiysis an they made them for free... it's a collaboration between institutions. Even if, IMHO, to discover if the stains are blood does not add nothing to the story of the flag

Regards
FLavio

23rd August 2008, 12:49 PM	#1
Spunjer Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Witness Protection Program Posts: 1,730	Translation help, please this was Datu Uto's flag, a Maguindanaon datu. one of the last powerful datus to resist against the spaniards. here he is pictured sitting next to the future president taft. i was wondering is someone can help me translate the writings on this flag btw, as i was inspecting this flag, i noticed these stains. here's the close up of how the lettering was produced: thanks in advance!

24th August 2008, 03:47 PM	#9
sipakatuo Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 59	It's written in an Arabic language. 'Laa ilahailallah Muhammad rasulallah fatu ala aliallah bi huwa inni fanuj saraf shulton Muhammad salim. As kinalu qudrattillah faharuddin.' Translation in English : 'There is no God but Allah and Muhmammad is the prophet, victory is destine by Allah and so saviour to Muhammad's followers.' Translation in Indonesia : 'Tiada Tuhan selain Allah dan Muhammad adalah utusan Allah, kemenangan adalah atas kehendak Allah SWT dan keselamatan bagi para pengikut Muhammad SAW.' I hope it helps... Last edited by sipakatuo; 24th August 2008 at 04:00 PM.

24th August 2008, 05:08 PM	#11
Dom Member Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Paris (FR*) Cairo (EG) Posts: 1,142	Hi Spunjer just a "try" because, it's not in clear Arabic language but may be that will give ideas to some Man of Letters I put a translation, or what seems to us, straight on the pic as it's a mix between arab/occidental writting, and english here what "should be "the sense" of those sentences Allah, there's only one God and Muhammed is his Messenger, « faitoo » ( ?) on (upon) Ali Allah ?????????????????????? Ashraf Sultan Mohammed ???????? Skandar ???? God respecting him for his pride of the religion Ashraf, Skandar should be names, but to be confirmed sorry, to don't be better à + Dom Attached Images

23rd August 2008, 01:08 PM	#2
Flavio Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Italia Posts: 1,243	I can't help with traslation, but I can say that this is REALLY FASCINATING!!!!

23rd August 2008, 02:04 PM	#3
Spunjer Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Witness Protection Program Posts: 1,730	yes indeedy, flavio. at first i thought it was a small flag. when it was laid out in front of me, i was surprise to see it was about 5ft by 10 ft or so.

23rd August 2008, 03:14 PM	#4
Flavio Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Italia Posts: 1,243	Do you think that the stains can be blood.....?

24th August 2008, 02:31 AM	#5
Spunjer Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Witness Protection Program Posts: 1,730	it kinda looks it, but then again, it could just be grease. i guess unless it's subjected to a CSI type test, we may never know.

24th August 2008, 03:43 AM	#6
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,290	Try a bit of hydrogen peroxide on an area; if the stain disappears it may well be blood .

24th August 2008, 12:51 PM	#7
Spunjer Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Witness Protection Program Posts: 1,730	hi rick, the flag actually belongs to a museum which i was fortunate enough to be given access to take a close up picture of.

24th August 2008, 03:36 PM	#8
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,290	Well, so much for that idea .

24th August 2008, 03:51 PM	#10
sipakatuo Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 59	One of muslim stronghold in Phillippine since ages ago...

24th August 2008, 08:30 PM	#12
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,217	What a fantastic piece of history. Thanks for sharing it here with us! I'm going to have to visit this musuem - seen it on internet, but they must have more than they show!!!! BTW - Skandar is another name for Alexander....... Spunger, would you show us a picture of the entire flag? Once read a history of Datu Uto. Once strong enough to be a Sultan!

25th August 2008, 03:22 AM	#13
Spunjer Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Witness Protection Program Posts: 1,730	Sipakatuo and Dom, thank you! any information i can get is really a big help! i'm assuming some of the words are in maguindanaon. the translation that was added to this flag's description in the museum's records, i felt was incomplete. Battara, actually that's all that was on the flag. the second picture is the most complete one i got, lol. i had to stand on a chair and raise the camera just to get that image

25th August 2008, 02:40 PM	#14
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,217	W W! So how big is this puppy?

25th August 2008, 02:42 PM	#15
Spunjer Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Witness Protection Program Posts: 1,730	lol, it was huge. guesstimating around 5x10 feet but i think it was bigger. we had to put four long tables together so we can decently spread the flag. here's a better view of the flag: