Old Tulwar, For info

JoeCanada42 · 29th January 2021, 03:39 AM

Hello everyone and thank you for having me on the forum.
I would like to share some swords,
Please have a look at my other posts when available
thank you for any information

Concerning this post the Tulwar / Talwar
Acquired in a local auction, in Pei Canada
The blade is 29- inch long and 1 and 1/2 inch wide
The eyelash mark is at the balance point

is this a typical curve and length or less than normal curve for tulwar?
Could it be wootz, or a european blade? how old could it be? is it military issue? is this a saber or hangar? katti or sirohi?

i will post additional photos when I can
(sorry if this thread was submitted twice once without photos..)

JoeCanada42 · 29th January 2021, 02:59 PM

additional photos.

mahratt · 29th January 2021, 06:43 PM

The curvature of tulwars varies greatly. Your tulwar is "within normal limits"

The blade is not European and not wootz. This is an ordinary talwar - a saber.

JoeCanada42 · 29th January 2021, 06:48 PM

Thank you Mahratt, any idea on age?

Jim McDougall · 29th January 2021, 07:59 PM

Welcome to the forum, and thank you for sharing this tulwar!
While the tulwar is of course a quite commonly seen sword, it is because there were countless of them produced, and they were swords actually used in combat, and even into the 1930s.

This is of course a very 'plain' example, and with knuckle guard etc. seems most probably northwest regions, with these being the 'fighting swords' of Rajputs and Sikh commonly known. The 'eyelash' (or sickle) marks were often copied by Indian blade makers from the Italian markings of this type usually regarded as Genoan (though far more broadly used).
These blades are of course in imitation of 18th century European blades with these multiple fullers. It seems the sickle marks occur most commonly on blades of the northwest frontiers, particularly on the type of tulwar known as the Afghan paluoar.

Clearly this is a 19th century tulwar, but most likely latter. The idea of 'military' is misperceived as in India the princely states maintained organized forces privately, not necessarily militarily. The British maintained 'native' regiments using varied local forces, and these often used their favored local weapons while some used British made arms.

The 'wootz' notion is typically a bit overplayed, and seldom seen on the typical fighting swords of regular ranks. It is expensive, usually on weapons of those in high station, and often known to be less than durable in combat situations.

mahratt · 31st January 2021, 10:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JoeCanada42

Thank you Mahratt, any idea on age?

I agree with Jim. Late 19th century.

JoeCanada42 · 31st January 2021, 02:28 PM

Thank you Mahratt and Jim Mcdougall. I may have posted this reply already by I dont see it for awhile now.
Thanks for all the info. It sounds much like what i expected from doing reasearch.
I was curious about the handle. Is it cast? Or forged?
Does it have a pattern? I have seen people call the handle wootz. Should i clean, polish and maybe etch the handle?

Kmaddock · 1st February 2021, 05:12 PM

Hi Joe.

No the handle is not going to be Wootz
The handle is made of 2 parts sheet steel generally brazed together, I would think the pieces are formed first before brazing.

Be careful, I picked up a tulwar around 8 years ago and now have perhaps 25 Indian swords and daggers, you will want more of them.

Welcome to the forum by the way.

Regards,

Ken

JoeCanada42 · 2nd February 2021, 07:10 PM

Thanks Kmaddock, and you are so right, since acquiring this talwar locally, i tried to purchase two from an ebay seller in india, unfortunatly the deal was to good to be true, and im still waiting for the full refund,(seller lost them,etc..)..,, , i dont think i will stop looking at swords soon, i like the history and the personal touch of so called ethnographic weapons.

29th January 2021, 03:39 AM	#1
JoeCanada42 Member Join Date: Jan 2021 Location: Canada Posts: 259	Old Tulwar, For info Hello everyone and thank you for having me on the forum. I would like to share some swords, Please have a look at my other posts when available thank you for any information Concerning this post the Tulwar / Talwar Acquired in a local auction, in Pei Canada The blade is 29- inch long and 1 and 1/2 inch wide The eyelash mark is at the balance point is this a typical curve and length or less than normal curve for tulwar? Could it be wootz, or a european blade? how old could it be? is it military issue? is this a saber or hangar? katti or sirohi? i will post additional photos when I can (sorry if this thread was submitted twice once without photos..) Attached Images Last edited by JoeCanada42; 29th January 2021 at 05:38 PM.

29th January 2021, 02:59 PM	#2
JoeCanada42 Member Join Date: Jan 2021 Location: Canada Posts: 259	additional photos. Attached Images

29th January 2021, 06:43 PM	#3
mahratt Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Russia Posts: 1,042	The curvature of tulwars varies greatly. Your tulwar is "within normal limits" The blade is not European and not wootz. This is an ordinary talwar - a saber.

29th January 2021, 06:48 PM	#4
JoeCanada42 Member Join Date: Jan 2021 Location: Canada Posts: 259	Thank you Mahratt, any idea on age?

29th January 2021, 07:59 PM	#5
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,954	Welcome to the forum, and thank you for sharing this tulwar! While the tulwar is of course a quite commonly seen sword, it is because there were countless of them produced, and they were swords actually used in combat, and even into the 1930s. This is of course a very 'plain' example, and with knuckle guard etc. seems most probably northwest regions, with these being the 'fighting swords' of Rajputs and Sikh commonly known. The 'eyelash' (or sickle) marks were often copied by Indian blade makers from the Italian markings of this type usually regarded as Genoan (though far more broadly used). These blades are of course in imitation of 18th century European blades with these multiple fullers. It seems the sickle marks occur most commonly on blades of the northwest frontiers, particularly on the type of tulwar known as the Afghan paluoar. Clearly this is a 19th century tulwar, but most likely latter. The idea of 'military' is misperceived as in India the princely states maintained organized forces privately, not necessarily militarily. The British maintained 'native' regiments using varied local forces, and these often used their favored local weapons while some used British made arms. The 'wootz' notion is typically a bit overplayed, and seldom seen on the typical fighting swords of regular ranks. It is expensive, usually on weapons of those in high station, and often known to be less than durable in combat situations.

31st January 2021, 02:28 PM	#7
JoeCanada42 Member Join Date: Jan 2021 Location: Canada Posts: 259	Thank you Mahratt and Jim Mcdougall. I may have posted this reply already by I dont see it for awhile now. Thanks for all the info. It sounds much like what i expected from doing reasearch. I was curious about the handle. Is it cast? Or forged? Does it have a pattern? I have seen people call the handle wootz. Should i clean, polish and maybe etch the handle?

1st February 2021, 05:12 PM	#8
Kmaddock Member Join Date: May 2014 Location: Ireland Posts: 543	Hi Joe. No the handle is not going to be Wootz The handle is made of 2 parts sheet steel generally brazed together, I would think the pieces are formed first before brazing. Be careful, I picked up a tulwar around 8 years ago and now have perhaps 25 Indian swords and daggers, you will want more of them. Welcome to the forum by the way. Regards, Ken

2nd February 2021, 07:10 PM	#9
JoeCanada42 Member Join Date: Jan 2021 Location: Canada Posts: 259	Thanks Kmaddock, and you are so right, since acquiring this talwar locally, i tried to purchase two from an ebay seller in india, unfortunatly the deal was to good to be true, and im still waiting for the full refund,(seller lost them,etc..)..,, , i dont think i will stop looking at swords soon, i like the history and the personal touch of so called ethnographic weapons.