Tribute to early Ottoman pistols

Kubur · 21st January 2017, 10:58 AM

They are so beautifull...

motan · 22nd January 2017, 04:06 PM

Hi Kubur, they are exquisite. Excuse my ignorance, but how old is "early" in Ottoman pistols? I have looked at many pics of Ottoman pistols, but I have never seen anything like them in shape or decoration.

It is funny (or sad) that when you compare old to newer pieces, what really gets lost with time is not the craft or quality, but mainly the esthetics...Just the right amount of decoration, harmonious color combinations, the elegance..I can not think of a logical reason.
Eytan

Kubur · 22nd January 2017, 07:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by motan

Hi Kubur, they are exquisite. Excuse my ignorance, but how old is "early" in Ottoman pistols? I have looked at many pics of Ottoman pistols, but I have never seen anything like them in shape or decoration.

It is funny (or sad) that when you compare old to newer pieces, what really gets lost with time is not the craft or quality, but mainly the esthetics...Just the right amount of decoration, harmonious color combinations, the elegance..I can not think of a logical reason.
Eytan

Hi Eytan,
These ones are from the late 17th c. maybe very early 18th c.
The first Ottoman pistols were wheellocks in the late 16th and early 17th c.
All the Ottoman pistols that you see on this forum are from the 19th c.
Very very few of them are from the very late 18th c.
And you can even see some from the very early 20th c.

You havent seen anything like them because they are very very rare.
Myself I'm amazed by the quality of the barrels... look at this steel...
all best
Kubur

motan · 22nd January 2017, 11:39 PM

Hi Kubur,
Yes, the barrels are beautiful, dark smooth steel. They must be heavy too. I like especially the hexagonal barrels. The locks, with short and thick frizzens are also different from later miquelet types. Do you know if they were also made in the Balkan, like most Ottoman pistols?

Battara · 23rd January 2017, 02:18 AM

Wonderful examples. Thanks for posting!

rickystl · 28th January 2017, 05:29 PM

Hi Kubur.

Those pistols are indeed beautiful. And, as you mentioed, early Ottoman examples that are extremely rare. A couple of observations: Notice the general style of the grip areas of the stocks. The pistol at the top seems to have an almost pentagonal grip. That pistol, along with the second and fourth pistols have stocks that remind me of Saxon style wheellock pistols. While the stock of the third pistol is similar to English style wheellock/doglock pistols of the second quarter of the 17th Century. We know that general styling of guns in the Ottoman Empire tended to last much longer than their European counterparts. So the late 18th Century for these is probably a reasonable guess with the miquelet locks. They are definately earlier than most encountered today.
Also, you seldom see Ottoman style pistols with full octagon barrels. They are usually tapered octagon-to-round, which usually is a lighter weight barrel.
Another curious feature of two of the pistols is the lack of trigger guards. Usually the only Ottoman style guns you see without trigger guards have ball style triggers. The two above have European style triggers without guards. Usually, the only pistols you see like this have Moroccan/Algerian origins. Very interesting.

Thanks for posting these pistols. I think they should all be sent to my house for further study and evaluation.

Rick

Kubur · 16th December 2018, 05:38 PM

They are amongst us, but we cannot see them...the Ottoman wheellocks

Fernando K · 17th December 2018, 12:43 PM

Hello

It does not seem that the wheel lock was built in the East, but that it was imported

On the flint specimens, it is worth mentioning the pedrero screw, which has antennas and / or a perforation to use a tool (rod), as in the lock "a la morlacca" or "mojaca", which mimics the lock of "agujeta" ", instead of the big rear ring.

Affectionately

21st January 2017, 10:58 AM	#1
Kubur Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Posts: 2,145	Tribute to early Ottoman pistols They are so beautifull... Attached Images

22nd January 2017, 04:06 PM	#2
motan Member Join Date: Apr 2016 Location: Jerusalem Posts: 274	Beautiful Hi Kubur, they are exquisite. Excuse my ignorance, but how old is "early" in Ottoman pistols? I have looked at many pics of Ottoman pistols, but I have never seen anything like them in shape or decoration. It is funny (or sad) that when you compare old to newer pieces, what really gets lost with time is not the craft or quality, but mainly the esthetics...Just the right amount of decoration, harmonious color combinations, the elegance..I can not think of a logical reason. Eytan

22nd January 2017, 11:39 PM	#4
motan Member Join Date: Apr 2016 Location: Jerusalem Posts: 274	Pistols Hi Kubur, Yes, the barrels are beautiful, dark smooth steel. They must be heavy too. I like especially the hexagonal barrels. The locks, with short and thick frizzens are also different from later miquelet types. Do you know if they were also made in the Balkan, like most Ottoman pistols?

16th December 2018, 05:38 PM	#7
Kubur Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Posts: 2,145	They are amongst us, but we cannot see them...the Ottoman wheellocks Attached Images

23rd January 2017, 02:18 AM	#5
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,226	Wonderful examples. Thanks for posting!

28th January 2017, 05:29 PM	#6
rickystl Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: St. Louis, MO area. Posts: 1,623	Hi Kubur. Those pistols are indeed beautiful. And, as you mentioed, early Ottoman examples that are extremely rare. A couple of observations: Notice the general style of the grip areas of the stocks. The pistol at the top seems to have an almost pentagonal grip. That pistol, along with the second and fourth pistols have stocks that remind me of Saxon style wheellock pistols. While the stock of the third pistol is similar to English style wheellock/doglock pistols of the second quarter of the 17th Century. We know that general styling of guns in the Ottoman Empire tended to last much longer than their European counterparts. So the late 18th Century for these is probably a reasonable guess with the miquelet locks. They are definately earlier than most encountered today. Also, you seldom see Ottoman style pistols with full octagon barrels. They are usually tapered octagon-to-round, which usually is a lighter weight barrel. Another curious feature of two of the pistols is the lack of trigger guards. Usually the only Ottoman style guns you see without trigger guards have ball style triggers. The two above have European style triggers without guards. Usually, the only pistols you see like this have Moroccan/Algerian origins. Very interesting. Thanks for posting these pistols. I think they should all be sent to my house for further study and evaluation. Rick

17th December 2018, 12:43 PM	#8
Fernando K Member Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 669	Hello It does not seem that the wheel lock was built in the East, but that it was imported On the flint specimens, it is worth mentioning the pedrero screw, which has antennas and / or a perforation to use a tool (rod), as in the lock "a la morlacca" or "mojaca", which mimics the lock of "agujeta" ", instead of the big rear ring. Affectionately