My presentation and a new friend

[CNK1]

Hello everyone,

so for my first post I will combine my presentation and share with you my last find

To begin, I'm Clement (21 y.o.). I live in France and I'm passionate by middle east and north african blades, with a weak for flissa... and yes not common you will say !!!

To continue this post, I present you now my last find. A really nice made flissa, this is the first one of this "type" I see. Not sure that's really old but surely end XIX century.
Maybe use by a notable man ?
Really plot by this little metallic ribbon with stars !
Every comment are welcome and expected !

Hope you will like.

Friendly Clement

[Yvain]

Damn, an other new French guy in my age group, seems like we're invading this forum ! ( Btw, is that username a reference to what I think ? )

Really nice flissa too, I don't know much about them but I've never seen one like this, it's almost always either the old straight ones or the really curved recent ones with an "S" shaped cross guard, this one almost looks like an intermediate form between those two. Really nice hilt and scabbard too !

[Battara]

Welcome to our little forum!

This is a nice piece. Not seen flyssa blade with a nimcha hilt of this quality before!

I would say it is from Morocco (or Algeria).

Looks like the scabbard tip is missing, but all in all I am impressed. Congratulations!

[Robert]

I do not believe the scabbard tip is missing, only that it cannot be seen very well. I have tried to modify one of the photo's to make it easier to see the tip, but this unfortunately is the best that I could do.

[Jim McDougall]

Clement, welcome to our forum, and you have given us a keen opportunity to see one of the nicest examples of the 'wedding nimcha' I have yet seen!
The term for these is most misleading, as these were actually 'ceremonial' or dress accoutrements, not simply for weddings or such events.


It is unusual to see one of these 'nimcha' style hilts with a flyssa blade, and I think you are right in that this one probably dates in the latter 19th c.
The quality of the mounts and blade are remarkable.

The flyssa itself is the sword of Kabylia in these regions in Algeria (said to have been named for the Iflyssen tribe Berbers who are believed to have been early makers of these). These long, needle pointed blade swords pretty much dropped off in production toward the later years of the 19th c. and these smaller dagger type examples perhaps became worn much as the koummya it seems as there was a great deal of diffusion in the Maghrebi coastal areas.

Stone (1935, p.234) describes the flyssa as the sword of the Kabyles of Morocco. It is believed that this attribution, when Kabylia is actually in Algeria, has to do with the connection with the Malakite Rite of Islam I Morocco. The five point star (Star of Solomon) which represents the Five Pillars of Islam is interestingly represented in the mounts of this dagger. That Star is since 1915 seen on the red flag of Morocco.

Therefore, a dagger of quality in Maghrebi nimcha mounts and Moroccan influenced Star of Solomon motif with Algerian Kabyle blade.

[CNK1]

Good morning,

thank's for your comments, I appreciate your help !

Happy to see that's you like this nimcha, this was a pleasure to present this one.

I join more picts of the scabbard tip.

[Kubur]

This is a master piece really!
Its Ottoman and from ALGERIA.
I will give you all the details later.
It's a very very nice piece.
Best,
Kubur

[Jim McDougall]

Originally Posted by Kubur

This is a master piece really!
Its Ottoman and from ALGERIA.
I will give you all the details later.
It's a very very nice piece.
Best,
Kubur

Excellent Kubur!!!
In research and discussions some time ago, we determined that the flyssa itself was very much key as a 'rite of passage' for Kabyle young men, whose first order of business before marriage was to attain 'his sword'.

While the flyssa of course carried all the traditional elements significant in their tribal traditions, and while not literally ever subdued by the Ottomans, the arms of the Ottomans were highly prized above the local flyssa.
Perhaps these factors might be present in the case of this most impressive example, which seems unusual to see a flyssa blade in Ottoman dress.

[CNK1]

@ Kubur, I wait impatiently for all you know about this piece !

Correct me if I'm wrong but the "ottoman period" of Algeria ends during 1830's , so this nimcha could date from this period or before ?

Best regards,

Clement

[Kubur]

Hi Clement, Hi Jim,

Now i can answer to you.
Look at the book of Andersen Gold and coral.
Look also at the Ottoman powder flask from Algiers that I posted before.
The quality of the work is typical from the 19th c. and the Ottomans.
The quality is amazing for the hilt and the scabbard.
The blade is normal for this so-called weeding nimcha.
By the way they are the real nimcha the short swords (see Elgood).
The other nimcha from Morocco are saifs of course.
As Jim said these swords are attributed to the Kabyles in Algeria.
The quality of the work pushes me to think that your nimcha, Clement, was done in Algiers.

Best,
Kubur

[CNK1]

Hello Kubur,

thank's for your help on this nimcha, a really interesting piece of history !

Do you think this one was made for someone special ? This is the only one of this "type" I've ever seen so I'm really curious to understand in which circumstance it was made.

Best regards,
Clement

[Jim McDougall]

Thank you Kubur for noting the Ottoman styling in this motif, and Clement, you have managed to collect a most handsome example of this type of Maghrebi weapon, in the manner of the 'wedding' type ceremonial pieces.

It is important to remember that traditional style and influences of other cultures and periods are not ceased at the demise of rule or change of power . Style and decoration are simply local preferences which may reflect many influences.
Even the Kabyle style blade may have been a gift or otherwise obtained from those people or regions, and mounted in appropriate dress to location, in this case appearing to be Algiers or that area.

[CNK1]

Hello Kubur, hello Jim

thank's again for your help ! Unfortunately I haven't the "Gold and coral" book but it's look like to be a very nice/ documented book !

Really happy to know where this nimcha come from, any idea of the personality whose carried this one?

Jim I totally understand what you mean, I took the reasoning in the wrong way,
it is not because it is of the Ottoman style that it is of the Ottoman period.

Best regards,
Clement

[Kubur]

Originally Posted by CNK1

Hello Kubur, hello Jim

thank's again for your help ! Unfortunately I haven't the "Gold and coral" book but it's look like to be a very nice/ documented book !

Really happy to know where this nimcha come from, any idea of the personality whose carried this one?

Jim I totally understand what you mean, I took the reasoning in the wrong way,
it is not because it is of the Ottoman style that it is of the Ottoman period.

Best regards,
Clement

Dear Clement,

Jim is (always) right.
For example, Algerian moukhala were produced until 1920.
And they were nearly the same than those produced during the Ottoman period.
Nevertheless I think yours is an old one 1800-1850 (due to the quality).
For the "personnality"

Probably someone with a big mustache

[CNK1]

Thank's again Kubur !

I've understand what mean Jim but maybe I misspoke

Anyway I'm really satisfied of this piece, she already took her place in front of my ottoman bishaq !

Unfortunately I don't have the big mustache to display with

[Jim McDougall]

Clement, again I must say you have come into the realm of arms collecting with a great piece, and it is always heartening to see someone with true passion and interest in learning about them as they begin collecting. They do indeed speak to us as they tell us their stories.

As for the person who might have had such a well appointed weapon, all we might surmise is that they were likely a person of means. Perhaps to someone of some official standing as this seems almost to be a 'commissioned' piece with that most unusual linear star motif.

Kubur, thank you for the kind words!!! May I ask that you have a word with my wife!!!??? who of course holds quite the contrary.

[CNK1]

Hello Jim,

thank's for your friendly message but If I have learn something from collecting, there is no passion/collection without sharing and when I can exchange with other enthusiasts this is the true meaning of collection for me !

Best regards
Clement