KRIS WITH TALISMAN

tanaruz · 29th May 2020, 11:26 AM

Hi friends,

Just sharing my first kris with talismatic inscriptions. Maranao? can the inscriptions be translated? regards

All the best,

Yves

David · 29th May 2020, 04:52 PM

That's a lovely example. Thanks for sharing.
May general view on talismanic inscriptions is that no, they cannot really be truly translated. While we do see repetition of various magickal sigils on blades like this the final intention is always going to be both personal and secret. We can only ever assume what the original intentions were and frankly i don't really sure it is our right as collectors to "discover" the inner workings of such personal magick.

Bob A · 29th May 2020, 05:06 PM

I'll readily grant the "personal" aspect of markings such as these, but "secret" doesn't fill the cognitive bill. After all, they're readily visible.

I could go with "occult" insofar as the actual meanings are hidden, except to those whose knowledge encompasses them. Of course, those who know will not openly discuss such things.

Battara · 29th May 2020, 10:23 PM

The blade looks Sulu/Tausug to me, although the hilt does look a little more Maguindanao.

tanaruz · 30th May 2020, 03:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Battara

The blade looks Sulu/Tausug to me, although the hilt does look a little more Maguindanao.

Hi Sir,

1) yes, the hilt does look a little more of Maguindanao;

2) blade: sulu/tausug: what are the feature/s of a kris blade that points it to the probability that it is of tausug origin? or maguindanaoan or maranao? very interested to know.

Rick · 30th May 2020, 04:10 AM

Some time spent with the Search engine here may help with your questions regarding identifying tribal origins.
Search terms like Sulu Kris, Tausug Kris, Maranao Kris etc.

David · 19th July 2020, 11:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bob A

I'll readily grant the "personal" aspect of markings such as these, but "secret" doesn't fill the cognitive bill. After all, they're readily visible.

I could go with "occult" insofar as the actual meanings are hidden, except to those whose knowledge encompasses them. Of course, those who know will not openly discuss such things.

Well Bob, the word "occult" literally means "hidden". And the very first definition of the word in Webster's dictionary is : not revealed : SECRET.
While i certain accept the word occult as applicable here i believe "secret" also fits the cognitive bill just fine. One could just as equally argue that these symbols aren't "hidden" either as they are in plain view.

As for those who knowledge encompasses such things, we will never know. Magickal talismans are often quite personal in design. Yes, they may use some more generally understood magickal symbols, but the entire "spell" for lack of a better work, may very well only be completely understood by the person who created it. The power of such things can be greatly diminished if they are understood by anyone other than the one creating the action.
Though we can guess that in general it was probably put in place to protect the warrior from harm and give him to power to overcome his enemies. However, the actual specifics of these markings probably can't be fully understood by any living person.

kino · 21st July 2020, 04:26 PM

Xasterix, I saw how this Kris cuts, pretty sharp blade. I like the way you tested it.
Did this Kris come with the hilt or did you have it commissioned?

kino · 21st July 2020, 04:39 PM

Tanaruz - good catch. A well preserved Kris. I like these understated hilts with horn ferrule, it’s beautiful. Thanks for sharing.

xasterix · 22nd July 2020, 04:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kino

Xasterix, I saw how this Kris cuts, pretty sharp blade. I like the way you tested it.
Did this Kris come with the hilt or did you have it commissioned?

Thanks Kino =) it came with that hilt/scabbard combo already.

I got this from a collection that was mostly made up of Maranao and Maguindanao kris. The curious thing was, all the Maguindanao kris (except for one) were rehilted and rescabbbarded in the Tugaya style. The Maranao kris were as-is (not flamboyant, I'm guessing original fittings).

There's a certain flavor that Tugaya maintains, a sort of flamboyance. I guess I can hypothesize that for a certain time era, the Maranao people resurrected old Maguindanao blades and gave them a more...catchy dress, which would fetch more $$$ as well when sold.

29th May 2020, 11:26 AM	#1
tanaruz Member Join Date: Apr 2020 Posts: 267	KRIS WITH TALISMAN Hi friends, Just sharing my first kris with talismatic inscriptions. Maranao? can the inscriptions be translated? regards All the best, Yves Attached Images

29th May 2020, 04:52 PM	#2
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,126	That's a lovely example. Thanks for sharing. May general view on talismanic inscriptions is that no, they cannot really be truly translated. While we do see repetition of various magickal sigils on blades like this the final intention is always going to be both personal and secret. We can only ever assume what the original intentions were and frankly i don't really sure it is our right as collectors to "discover" the inner workings of such personal magick.

29th May 2020, 05:06 PM	#3
Bob A Member Join Date: Feb 2014 Posts: 427	I'll readily grant the "personal" aspect of markings such as these, but "secret" doesn't fill the cognitive bill. After all, they're readily visible. I could go with "occult" insofar as the actual meanings are hidden, except to those whose knowledge encompasses them. Of course, those who know will not openly discuss such things.

29th May 2020, 10:23 PM	#4
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,226	The blade looks Sulu/Tausug to me, although the hilt does look a little more Maguindanao.

30th May 2020, 04:10 AM	#6
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,293	Some time spent with the Search engine here may help with your questions regarding identifying tribal origins. Search terms like Sulu Kris, Tausug Kris, Maranao Kris etc.

21st July 2020, 04:26 PM	#8
kino Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,003	Xasterix, I saw how this Kris cuts, pretty sharp blade. I like the way you tested it. Did this Kris come with the hilt or did you have it commissioned?

21st July 2020, 04:39 PM	#9
kino Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,003	Tanaruz - good catch. A well preserved Kris. I like these understated hilts with horn ferrule, it’s beautiful. Thanks for sharing.