BANJARMASIN KERIS, unfortunately not mine

asomotif · 25th June 2011, 06:06 PM

Unfortunately I was not able to purchase this one.
But after a few weeks I sort of grew over the dissapointment and now want to share the pictures to enjoy

,for reference and discussion

It was offered as a restoration project.
Funny enough a lot of buyers suggested to the seller that the pendok could not be the original as it should have been more decorated/embellished

Note the wrangka's decoration on floral motif on both sides.

Best regards,
Willem

Battara · 25th June 2011, 07:09 PM

Wow - that's a horn wranga. Is this a type of rhino horn?

Marcokeris · 25th June 2011, 07:12 PM

ukiran and top-sarong seem very very nice

Sajen · 25th June 2011, 07:19 PM

Hi Willem,

thank's for sharing. very nice sampir. I think from "white buffalo" horn. Can we see the blade as well?

Regards,

Detlef

asomotif · 25th June 2011, 09:40 PM

I think the wrangka is Buffalohorn.
Not as special as rhino, but still quite a large peice of buffalohorn.
It must have accounted for certain status.

Here some more pictures.
The blade is not cleaned and not photographed in a good way.
But it gives an impression.

Jean · 25th June 2011, 10:02 PM

Hello Willem,
The sheath crosspiece made from carved horn is very nice indeed but besides the hilt, what makes it a Banjarmasin kris?
Best regards
Jean

asomotif · 26th June 2011, 02:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jean

but besides the hilt, what makes it a Banjarmasin kris?

Hello Jean,
There is not very much information around, but as far as I know the blades are always import blades. So there is not a "Banjarmasin" style of blades.

So I call it Banjarmasin when the hilt is banjarmasin.
From pictures in other threads I found that often the wrangka is quite simple and sometimes almost symetric in design.
Further, the examples I found with pendok's all have very simple brass plain pendoks.

This wrangka has a floral decoration something which is found more often in the Banjarmasin area due to muslim influence. It is also known from Negara weapons. such as parang nabur;s and the scarce negara mandau's.

If someone has more and/or different info on this I would surely like to hear it.

Best regards,
Willem

Jean · 26th June 2011, 10:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by asomotif

Hello Jean,
There is not very much information around, but as far as I know the blades are always import blades. So there is not a "Banjarmasin" style of blades.

So I call it Banjarmasin when the hilt is banjarmasin.
From pictures in other threads I found that often the wrangka is quite simple and sometimes almost symetric in design.
Further, the examples I found with pendok's all have very simple brass plain pendoks.

This wrangka has a floral decoration something which is found more often in the Banjarmasin area due to muslim influence. It is also known from Negara weapons. such as parang nabur;s and the scarce negara mandau's.

If someone has more and/or different info on this I would surely like to hear it.

Best regards,
Willem

Hello Willem,
I agree that there is very little information about the Banjarmasin krisses.
According to Van Duuren's book "The Kris" page 82, many kris blades were forged in Negara during the 19th Century so not all the blades were imported.
Regarding the warangka crosspiece, most of them have a special kidney shape as shown in Frey's book page 72 for instance and other reference books. I never saw a crosspiece shaped like the one on your pictures but I would rather attribute its origin to East Java/ Madura.
Would you attribute my kris to Banjarmasin also since it has a Banjar hilt?
Best regards
Jean

asomotif · 27th June 2011, 07:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jean

Would you attribute my kris to Banjarmasin also since it has a Banjar hilt?
Best regards
Jean

Dear Jean,
Do you have better pictures of the hilt.

Best regards,
Willem

VVV · 27th June 2011, 10:28 AM

I am with Jean on this. You see Banjar hilts quite often on keris in other regions too.

Michael

asomotif · 27th June 2011, 12:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VVV

I am with Jean on this. You see Banjar hilts quite often on keris in other regions too.

Michael

Michael,
- Do you mean ïn other regions" or from other regions ?

- as for the wrangka. the floral decoration on this type wrangka is new to me.
Is this something you see on east java / madura keris ?
if so, please post some examples

best regards,
Willem

VVV · 27th June 2011, 02:19 PM

Willem, I mean in other regions.
Somewhere I have read that the Banjar hilts were quite popular and that's why they were imported to other regions (I can't remember in which keris book I have read this at the moment. But I will get back to you when I find it unless some of the other collectors find it before me) .
Now and then you see the Banjar nunggak semi version for instance on Javanese keris. Both more recent combinations, like at "HH"

, but I have also seen them on keris in old collections and museums.
In Tropen there is a keris collected in Lampung with a similar Banjar hilt as yours (below). But the rest of the keris doesn't look like neither a traditional Banjar nor Lampung combination so it's hard to know it's story...

Michael

Jean · 27th June 2011, 02:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by asomotif

Dear Jean,
Do you have better pictures of the hilt.

Best regards,
Willem

Dear Willem,
Attached are additional pictures of my hilt. I believe that it is original but in exceptional condition so may be not very old, the missing stones visible on the pictures were replaced.
Best regards
Jean

asomotif · 27th June 2011, 05:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jean

I believe that it is original but in exceptional condition so may be not very old, the missing stones visible on the pictures were replaced.
Best regards
Jean

Interesting hilt.
The technique / workmanship looks very authenthic to me.
Could it be that it was re-gilded ? Do you have any provenance ?

Best regards,
Willem

Jean · 27th June 2011, 09:34 PM

Hello Willem,
The filigree decoration looks more elaborate than on some other (older?) pieces. The selut seems matching, I saw the pictures of a similar one belonging to a famous German collector recently. I don't know if the piece was recently gilded or not but would not think so because of the stones. Regarding the origin of the kris, it was found and refurbished by my partner in Solo.
Best regards
Jean

Battara · 27th June 2011, 10:44 PM

Are these thin gold or gilt silver/brass? They look like gilt brass to me...

asomotif · 28th June 2011, 12:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Battara

Are these thin gold or gilt silver/brass? They look like gilt brass to me...

Yep, normally they are gilt brass. Is that a bad thing

Battara · 28th June 2011, 03:38 AM

Nope just curious - gold would be royal and more expensive.

25th June 2011, 06:06 PM	#1
asomotif Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 2,225	BANJARMASIN KERIS, unfortunately not mine Unfortunately I was not able to purchase this one. But after a few weeks I sort of grew over the dissapointment and now want to share the pictures to enjoy ,for reference and discussion It was offered as a restoration project. Funny enough a lot of buyers suggested to the seller that the pendok could not be the original as it should have been more decorated/embellished Note the wrangka's decoration on floral motif on both sides. Best regards, Willem Attached Images

25th June 2011, 09:40 PM	#5
asomotif Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 2,225	I think the wrangka is Buffalohorn. Not as special as rhino, but still quite a large peice of buffalohorn. It must have accounted for certain status. Here some more pictures. The blade is not cleaned and not photographed in a good way. But it gives an impression. Attached Images

27th June 2011, 02:19 PM	#12
VVV Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Sweden Posts: 1,637	Willem, I mean in other regions. Somewhere I have read that the Banjar hilts were quite popular and that's why they were imported to other regions (I can't remember in which keris book I have read this at the moment. But I will get back to you when I find it unless some of the other collectors find it before me) . Now and then you see the Banjar nunggak semi version for instance on Javanese keris. Both more recent combinations, like at "HH" , but I have also seen them on keris in old collections and museums. In Tropen there is a keris collected in Lampung with a similar Banjar hilt as yours (below). But the rest of the keris doesn't look like neither a traditional Banjar nor Lampung combination so it's hard to know it's story... Michael Attached Images Last edited by VVV; 27th June 2011 at 03:23 PM. Reason: added comment and Tropen example

25th June 2011, 07:09 PM	#2
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,226	Wow - that's a horn wranga. Is this a type of rhino horn?

25th June 2011, 07:12 PM	#3
Marcokeris Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Italy Posts: 928	ukiran and top-sarong seem very very nice

25th June 2011, 07:19 PM	#4
Sajen Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Germany, Dortmund Posts: 8,788	Hi Willem, thank's for sharing. very nice sampir. I think from "white buffalo" horn. Can we see the blade as well? Regards, Detlef

25th June 2011, 10:02 PM	#6
Jean Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,740	Hello Willem, The sheath crosspiece made from carved horn is very nice indeed but besides the hilt, what makes it a Banjarmasin kris? Best regards Jean

27th June 2011, 10:28 AM	#10
VVV Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Sweden Posts: 1,637	I am with Jean on this. You see Banjar hilts quite often on keris in other regions too. Michael

27th June 2011, 09:34 PM	#15
Jean Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,740	Hello Willem, The filigree decoration looks more elaborate than on some other (older?) pieces. The selut seems matching, I saw the pictures of a similar one belonging to a famous German collector recently. I don't know if the piece was recently gilded or not but would not think so because of the stones. Regarding the origin of the kris, it was found and refurbished by my partner in Solo. Best regards Jean

27th June 2011, 10:44 PM	#16
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,226	Are these thin gold or gilt silver/brass? They look like gilt brass to me...

28th June 2011, 03:38 AM	#18
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,226	Nope just curious - gold would be royal and more expensive.