Russian Sword for I D and Comment

Iliad · 16th June 2009, 12:26 AM

Hi all, here is another piece from my collection. Russian I believe, but will appreciate more info. Is it cavalry or foot soldier? Officer or ordinary grunt?
Brian

Lee · 16th June 2009, 12:58 AM

In leafing through Eugene Mollo's Russian Military Swords: 1801-1917 this saber appears to follow the overall pattern of a dragoon (mounted) shashka, soldiers (ordinary grunt), "system of 1881". - however, I have never seen one with a cast brass grip before; the grip is usually wood.

Yours would clearly be later (hammer and sickle mark) and the markings leave me wondering if it were made in one of the outlying Soviet era republiks; for a while several decades ago newly made examples with serial numbers as modern Arabic numerals were showing up, but these also had wooden grips.

I recall having really wanted an old one of these when I was in college - I never did get a proper one, but ultimately satisfied the itch with a very, very battered 1841 model with the quillon pierced to mimic the later model.

Hopefully someone who knows their militaria better will be able to be more specific about your example.

Norman McCormick · 17th June 2009, 07:51 PM

Hi Brian,
A number of these Shaska and bayonet combinations came out of China quite recently, whilst my knowledge does not extend to being able to say for sure that this is one of these the general lack of quality would tend to make me think that this is indeed a Chinese repro. Even the post 1917 ones, which this would appear to be, although utility, were in my experience better made than this one. Please don't take my doubts as a positive affirmation that this is a copy, I sincerely hope it's not, but it would be worthwhile to investigate the possibility further.
My Regards,
Norman.

ariel · 17th June 2009, 09:45 PM

Sorry to confirm: recent Chinese manufacture. The markings make no sense: it's just like one of us would want to imitate Chinese hieroglyphs using random squiggles, magazine ads and titles of Bruce Lee's movies.

Lee · 17th June 2009, 10:14 PM

What does make sense are Ariel and Norman's remarks.

Iliad · 17th June 2009, 10:29 PM

Thanks (I think!) for the advice, guys. Naturally very disappointed to find that it is a copy, but at least it looks good and will impress visitors.
Life is hard ain't it!
Brian
P S Deep sigh

16th June 2009, 12:26 AM	#1
Iliad Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 187	Russian Sword for I D and Comment Hi all, here is another piece from my collection. Russian I believe, but will appreciate more info. Is it cavalry or foot soldier? Officer or ordinary grunt? Brian Attached Images

16th June 2009, 12:58 AM	#2
Lee EAAF Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Upstate New York, USA Posts: 900	Soviet, probably made in an Outlying Republik In leafing through Eugene Mollo's Russian Military Swords: 1801-1917 this saber appears to follow the overall pattern of a dragoon (mounted) shashka, soldiers (ordinary grunt), "system of 1881". - however, I have never seen one with a cast brass grip before; the grip is usually wood. Yours would clearly be later (hammer and sickle mark) and the markings leave me wondering if it were made in one of the outlying Soviet era republiks; for a while several decades ago newly made examples with serial numbers as modern Arabic numerals were showing up, but these also had wooden grips. I recall having really wanted an old one of these when I was in college - I never did get a proper one, but ultimately satisfied the itch with a very, very battered 1841 model with the quillon pierced to mimic the later model. Hopefully someone who knows their militaria better will be able to be more specific about your example.

17th June 2009, 10:14 PM	#5
Lee EAAF Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Upstate New York, USA Posts: 900	Bummer What does make sense are Ariel and Norman's remarks.

17th June 2009, 07:51 PM	#3
Norman McCormick Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 1,584	Hi Brian, A number of these Shaska and bayonet combinations came out of China quite recently, whilst my knowledge does not extend to being able to say for sure that this is one of these the general lack of quality would tend to make me think that this is indeed a Chinese repro. Even the post 1917 ones, which this would appear to be, although utility, were in my experience better made than this one. Please don't take my doubts as a positive affirmation that this is a copy, I sincerely hope it's not, but it would be worthwhile to investigate the possibility further. My Regards, Norman.

17th June 2009, 09:45 PM	#4
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	Sorry to confirm: recent Chinese manufacture. The markings make no sense: it's just like one of us would want to imitate Chinese hieroglyphs using random squiggles, magazine ads and titles of Bruce Lee's movies.

17th June 2009, 10:29 PM	#6
Iliad Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 187	Thanks (I think!) for the advice, guys. Naturally very disappointed to find that it is a copy, but at least it looks good and will impress visitors. Life is hard ain't it! Brian P S Deep sigh