SAJEN kerises

A. G. Maisey · 1st June 2009, 01:25 AM

Yes Pak Ganja, during that period of the 1930's ---1940's everybody and his brother was spreading the word on Majapahit keris, probably to demonstrate their depth of knowledge of Javanese history and culture, and to drive home the point that they were academic researchers.

This is what happens in all fields. Writers pick up an idea from a previous writer and either appropriate it as their own, or if the previous writer is already well known, they quote him to bolster acceptance of their own writing. Nobody was more well known than Raffles in this matter, so Raffles and keris and Majapahit got a mention, then Gardner's "keris Majapahit" got a mention. In common memory the two meld together, and before you know where you are you have some people thinking that Raffles originated the "keris Majapahit".

However, Gardner was, I believe, the first to mention keris Majapahit, in his 1933 paper --- see my previous post--- the other writers came later, and I believe were riding on Gardner's shirttails --- they had picked up the name from his writing.

Actually, Raffles does not mention "keris Majapahit", he mentions a king of Majapahit who was able to forge keris by the use of finger pressure. He was aware of the kingdom of Majapahit, he had an interest in Javanese history, myth, and legend, but nowhere does he specifically use the term "keris Majapahit" --- well, not as far as I can see, anyway, its a big book.

In fact, the OUP reprint that I have is two big volumes.

Rick, there's not a real lot on keris and weaponry in Raffles. For somebody with a high interest in Jawa, it is interesting reading, but for somebody with a high interest in weaponry its most definitely not particularly useful. I think it currently sells for upwards of $500; I bought my copy new about 35 or 40 years ago. Near as I can recall it cost a bit more than $100.

kulbuntet · 16th June 2009, 03:54 PM

Hi All,

If someone want to read Raffles history of Java, here a download link. Download will start, file in Pdf.

http://books.google.nl/books/downloa...6fZkRbn5tcfcEw

regards Michel

Rick · 16th June 2009, 05:20 PM

Thanks Michel !

HiFi · 18th June 2009, 06:57 AM

Quote:

Putut? Yes, you are right. In Jakarta too, keris people sometimes mentioned it as "keris putut" too, if I want to accentuate on the hilt ornament. And you may say, "keris sajen" too for general naming... But dhapur putut, that's different thing. Also dhapur of "putut kembar" (twin putut, one in the gandhik, and the other in the wadidang)...

GANJAWULUNG

Thankyou Pak Ganja

ganjawulung · 20th May 2016, 03:48 PM

Just updating old topics on "keris sajen" as mentioned by Mariusgmioc....

Sajen · 22nd May 2016, 11:43 PM

some of mine

22nd May 2016, 11:43 PM	#6
Sajen Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Germany, Dortmund Posts: 8,786	some of mine Attached Images

1st June 2009, 01:25 AM	#1
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,896	Yes Pak Ganja, during that period of the 1930's ---1940's everybody and his brother was spreading the word on Majapahit keris, probably to demonstrate their depth of knowledge of Javanese history and culture, and to drive home the point that they were academic researchers. This is what happens in all fields. Writers pick up an idea from a previous writer and either appropriate it as their own, or if the previous writer is already well known, they quote him to bolster acceptance of their own writing. Nobody was more well known than Raffles in this matter, so Raffles and keris and Majapahit got a mention, then Gardner's "keris Majapahit" got a mention. In common memory the two meld together, and before you know where you are you have some people thinking that Raffles originated the "keris Majapahit". However, Gardner was, I believe, the first to mention keris Majapahit, in his 1933 paper --- see my previous post--- the other writers came later, and I believe were riding on Gardner's shirttails --- they had picked up the name from his writing. Actually, Raffles does not mention "keris Majapahit", he mentions a king of Majapahit who was able to forge keris by the use of finger pressure. He was aware of the kingdom of Majapahit, he had an interest in Javanese history, myth, and legend, but nowhere does he specifically use the term "keris Majapahit" --- well, not as far as I can see, anyway, its a big book. In fact, the OUP reprint that I have is two big volumes. Rick, there's not a real lot on keris and weaponry in Raffles. For somebody with a high interest in Jawa, it is interesting reading, but for somebody with a high interest in weaponry its most definitely not particularly useful. I think it currently sells for upwards of $500; I bought my copy new about 35 or 40 years ago. Near as I can recall it cost a bit more than $100.

16th June 2009, 03:54 PM	#2
kulbuntet Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Amsterdam, Netherlands Posts: 159	Hi All, If someone want to read Raffles history of Java, here a download link. Download will start, file in Pdf. http://books.google.nl/books/downloa...6fZkRbn5tcfcEw regards Michel

16th June 2009, 05:20 PM	#3
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,293	Thanks Michel !

20th May 2016, 03:48 PM	#5
ganjawulung Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: J a k a r t a Posts: 991	Just updating old topics on "keris sajen" as mentioned by Mariusgmioc....