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#31 |
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Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 173
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Hi all,
Very interesting all You said. Bendo, Bendho, Bedong, different words, different shapes from Sunda to West Java. : confused: Now I really need pics about what you really mean. Regards Paolo |
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#32 |
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Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Room 101, Glos. UK
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hi. i have one of the dutch klewangs i bought at an arms show here in the UK, scabbard is oiled dark brown leather with a brass tip, steel reenforcement at the throat, blade is dark steel, very sharp, light pitting in some places, guard steel, black rust patina, grips wood scales, 3 brass cutlers rivets, large pommel screw at end. blade is marked PD over a LUNESCHLOSS over SOLINGEN just ahead of the guard and the opposite side has a very small figure i can not make out. blade is 4mm x 35 mm. at the guard with a distal taper down to about 2.5mm just before the false edge starts
![]() ![]() Last edited by kronckew; 24th January 2007 at 08:58 PM. |
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#33 | |
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#34 | |
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#35 | |
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Join Date: Aug 2006
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solingen and hembrug both from netherland. and may have better iron quality than ' milsco' and ' vince' . the milsco klewang are dull but the hembrug seem to be more sharp...and much older. I just got it yesterday after my friens brough my 27 pieces of klewangs... there was only one 'hembrug' I found...others are milsco and one unmark klewang. solingen ,hembrug, and unmark klewang has better tip shape than most milsco. the edge has better curve and make it able to be come sharp. milsco klewang has line on its edge....and not sharp... ![]() look at the edge under MILSCO mark, machine made sword that hard to be sharp...dull it is. |
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#36 |
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Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Toronto, Canada
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To me it looks like a fancy "B", the right leg of the letter tuks inwards not outwards. I really like these Ferrylaki, but what do you mean that the line on the dge of the Milsco blade is hard to sharpen? Even staright edges can be sharpened very well. Too bad you only have one marked Hembrug...what would the unmarked ones be? Would they also be Dutch?
All the best, Emanuel |
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#37 | |
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Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: The Netherlands
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The sabre looks like a klewang used by the dutch army, but this guard divers from the klewang guard. As far as I know, the Dutch didn't used german weapons. So I doubt if you can call this a dutch klewang. But I do like it. |
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#38 | |
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i am of course aware that solingen is in germany, they made blades for a number of other countries as well. more pics ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Last edited by kronckew; 25th January 2007 at 10:26 PM. |
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#39 | |
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Join Date: Aug 2006
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I have check all the swords they have, I only found one hembrug without its original scarbard. so I took other blades' scarbard as a replacement. and every scrabard fits with any sword, like they were made exactly the same size and same curve... the hembrug blade doesnt have the line on its edge, but it has curve edge that make its sharper than milsco. the iron/steel seem different also...the tip of hembrug and milsco are different...the hand guard oh hembrug also has a little differrent from milsco. there is a small bent on its upper tip. the pics are coming soon. |
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#40 |
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Kronckew,
Yes, after your last pictures I see that the guard of your sabre is identical to the dutch klewang and the American MILSCO cutlass. But I still doubt if you may call it a Dutch KNIL klewang because of the German Solingen mark. I don't think the Dutch army used German manufactured weapons, especially in that period. |
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#41 |
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this has become most interesting, we seem to have almost exactly the same design being used by the USA, Holland, Japan and Germany all about the same time near the beginning of ww2. wonder who else was using them.
i've been holding back a tidbit of info to see what developed. after i had bought the item, i'd had it for about 10 yrs. when i saw that cold steel had made what appeared to be a copy, i found what looked much like it listed as a US navy cutlass, then came across one of them with a cut down guard which had been apparently a captured dutch version modified & reissued by the japanese in se asia, then i saw the references to the dutch klewang origin & it appeared to be a direct match, so i've thought of it as dutch since. However, when i had initially purchased it here in the UK, i was told that it was a german cutlass 'liberated' by a british MTB officer from a german e-boat (Schnellboot or S-Boot) they had captured during ww2. as i had a father-in-law who had been a MTB captain in the war & lost a leg in battle against an s-boot, it seemed fated to come home with me. this had seemed less likely up till now after the later developements. however, seems like there was a bit of cross cultural drift of the design to both sides; the very last gasp of the edged sword-length weapon in actual combat issue and all sides used the same one? edited: further fodder: This Link seems to indicate some of the earlier pre-war ones were made in germany (solingen) for the original designer, General Van Heutsz, prior to them being made in hemburg. as they said there , it's an enigma wrapped in a conundrum. Last edited by kronckew; 27th January 2007 at 07:07 AM. |
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#42 |
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Join Date: May 2006
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I have found this to be an almost unbelievably enthralling discussion--the way in which it has moved from Sundanese and Javanese tools and weaponry to European and now US military issue weapons demonstrates how the differing strands of weaponry are so inextricably interwoven.
Upon reflection, I think that this thread demonstrates just how very difficult it can be to define exactly what a sword is. Burton spent a chapter telling us that you can't really define a sword, but you'll recognise one when you see one. However, we were talking about the Javanese bendho. Here is a picture of a bendho lifted from an earlier posting by Marto Suwignyo. Somewhat more elegant than one would expect to see for sale in a Central Javanese market, nonetheless, the form---except of course for the Rojomolo tip--- is the same as for today's common or garden variety bendho. Last edited by A. G. Maisey; 27th January 2007 at 08:58 AM. |
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#43 | |
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Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 285
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very beautiful bendo I think... where did you find it?? |
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#44 |
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Join Date: May 2006
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As I said:- I lifted the picture from an earlier post by Marto Suwignyo
Here is the link . Scroll down and you will see the picture and his post. http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=841 |
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