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21st November 2023, 10:26 PM | #1 | ||||||
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We know from the research and physical examples that J J Runkel imported into the UK completed swords into the UK; the 1788 pattern from my collection is one of those and a perfect example of a generic 1780s "Hussar" sabre, that would otherwise be labelled "European Hussar Sabre" were it not for the British Ordinance board stamp. The capacity to make those swords had to be in place for him to be able to supply them. I can show you two other examples of near-identical swords made by Solingen that, were it not for markings, would be nearly impossible to identify accurately. Quote:
Also, there is a huge element of selection bias in the examples I've shown. Since I have primarily focused my personal collecting research on French, British and where possible, Dutch swords. It is only natural that the database of images I have gathered and drawn from will heavily feature swords from these nations. I am sure there are plenty of examples from other nations that I have overlooked since they fall outside of my personal field of interest. With the collectors I have spoken to who share a similar field of interest, it is pretty much a given that the Rose is a Solingen mark, the questions are more around when it started, stopped and what they mean. If you or anyone else has examples of blades with the Rose that can be positively identified as not having been produced in Solingen, I would be truly grateful. Quote:
The two S&K blades I have shown earlier are pretty much identical in decorations, including the S&K logo on the ricasso. Since S&K were specifically traders, they would have purchased these blades with the decorations pre-applied for on-sale to the French cutlers. The smallsword in my collection with the blade from Johann & Clemens Boegel would have been sold with their I.C.B logo and decorations applied to the blade. Of the twenty-two British swords in my collection, six of them have blades imported by Runkel, four of them have near identical decorations even though they were sold to four different cutlers (Prosser, Bennett, Archer of Dublin and one unknown). Of the two that have atypical decorations, the first is the 1788 that was imported as a complete sword and the second is a 1796 Pattern heavy cavalry officers dress sword. Of the 1796, these have a double-edged blade and the majority of the surviving examples have plain blades with Runkels' signature in the fuller. When I look at a single-edged British sword, I can instantly spot that it carries a Runkel or Solingen blade purely by its decorations. Naturally, it is likely that bare Solingen blades were imported and then locally decorated in British fashion, but without a Solingen stamp on the blade there is no way to identify an example. Existing blades marked to Solingen with British decorations are rare in my experience. Quote:
The period that we're talking about, 1770 - 1820, is where we see an increase in the use of complex decorations such as talismanic symbols, etching and chemical blue and gilt finishing. This is the period where the Rose can be found and then disappears. Being able to pinpoint when it disappears helps us date swords better as well. I agree that the fashion for talismanic symbols very likely came to Western Europe via the Hungarian hussars. Quote:
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22nd November 2023, 03:08 AM | #2 |
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Location: North Queensland, Australia
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G'day Radboud,
I will back you up that Solingen blade decoration is instantly recognizable. As an example the photo below shows similar decoration on a British 1796 heavy cavalry officers undress sword with a Runkel blade (left) and a French Heavy cavalry officer guarde de bataille sword with a blade marked ISB. Cheers, Bryce |
22nd November 2023, 04:08 AM | #3 |
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Thank you for the photos Bryce, does the GdB have a Rose or Solingen written on the spine? I'd love to see more photos of that area if you have them.
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22nd November 2023, 05:39 AM | #4 |
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Location: North Queensland, Australia
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Here you go.
Cheers, Bryce |
22nd November 2023, 05:46 AM | #5 |
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Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: North Queensland, Australia
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Here is another sword you may be interested in.
Cheers, Bryce |
22nd November 2023, 05:51 AM | #6 |
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Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: North Queensland, Australia
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Here is a British 1796 infantry officer's sword with a Solingen blade, that isn't marked to Runkel. This one isn't from my collection.
Cheers, Bryce |
22nd November 2023, 06:59 AM | #7 |
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Location: New Zealand
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Lovely examples Bryce, that GdB sabre is unique!
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