Chronological listing of Polish-Lithuanian and Hungarian sabers

[Teisani]

THE ADORATION OF THE MAGI. About 1514. St. Paul and Peter's Catholic Church, Dryswiaty, Braslau district, Vitebsk region. The main painting might be from 1514, but in my opinion the inserted image of the hussar is a later addition, due to the stylistic difference between the two images. So unfortunately I don't think it can provide much info.
Hmmm... maybe the coat of arms next can be of some use in dating the hussar depiction.
https://commons.m.wikimedia.org/wiki...90;ы.jpg



He doesn't very different to the figures in the "Tablica gołuchowska" from circa 1620. https://commons.m.wikimedia.org/wiki...2;uchowska.jpg. Note: the example on the Wikipedia page seems to be a reproduction. I believe this one to be the original.

[Teisani]

This site looks like a nice source for some depictions. https://17c.org.ua/dzherela

The embassy of Bohdan Khmelnytskyi to Janusz Radziwill in 1651. Abraham van Westerfeld. They look like tatar sabres

[Teisani]

Here's something that caught my eye. While browsing the pictures in the site mentioned above, this "fragment of a painting of the palace in Kielce (Poland) in the 1630s" had two hussars, who appear to be wearing sabres with typical boot-hilt, and cross-guard with side-ring. It's not the best clarity, so the side-ring aspect is debatable.


Then I remembered that I had seen a sabre with a side-ring before... in this depiction of Nikola Zrinski (Ban of Croatia 1647-1664) from the Klebebände (Band 2) by Jacob von Sandrart (publisher) 17th century. At first I thought it was a fantasy design, but now I must reconsider my verdict.
https://commons.m.wikimedia.org/wiki...and_02_337.jpg

[Teisani]

Add to this, the fact that in the Stockholm Roll from 1605 we have some Polish infantryman carrying what appear to be sabres with knuckle-bows and side-rings. They could be dusägge/dussack type sabres, but usually these have more complex hilts and pommels. So, any opinions?

[awdaniec666]

Originally Posted by Teisani

So, any opinions?

This could be the early Lithuanian modification of Hungarian sabers. Lithuanians seem to have preferred more protective guards. There are plenty of examples from around 1700. These here could be predecessors. This is just a guess for now.

[Teisani]

Patrick, I would like to comment a bit on a picture in karabela section of your document on page 1. The picture is from "Turnierbuch von Erzherzog Ferdinand II. Fol. 167, Austria after 1557, Kunstkammer Inv.-Nr. 5134. On closer inspection, I don't think de depiction is of a karabela-hilted sabre, rather a banana-hilt. I've attached it, and a few more photos from it. https://www.facebook.com/Wissenswert...Epochen/photos






And from Hochzeitskodex Erzherzog Ferdinands II.: Ferdinand und Wilhelm 1582. Künstler/in: Sigmund Elsässer

[awdaniec666]

Teisani,
hm.., with respect to the quality of the paintings I think we can interpret the hilts as they are shown to us and that hilt is clearly shaped like an eagle-head.