Beautiful knife

ariel · 3rd May 2006, 01:37 PM

I am not into "Western" blades, but just could not ignore this one. I was not a bidder.
This is likely Mexican (the eagle head is a giveaway).
Look at the quality of deep engraving and the intricacy of the handle:
Assadullah Cancuni

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...tem=6625415228

Rick · 3rd May 2006, 03:41 PM

Hi Ariel ,
I'm not so sure this is Mexican work ; the motifs are atypical for the stuff that I have seen from our brothers South of the Border .

It is indeed stunning work at any rate .

Rich · 3rd May 2006, 06:00 PM

I was looking at that knife myself, but it went to high for my cheap
pocketbook :-) Not sure of the Mexican attribution, maybe Spanish
or Brazil? Wild guesses there. Pretty knife whoever and where ever
it come from.

Rich

Tim Simmons · 3rd May 2006, 08:04 PM

My gut reaction from the decoration was India? just something about the bird. The scabbard is not very Indian? Saying that the bird appears to be a peacock with those little feathers on its head. I know a rich South American might have peacocks in his garden but it is not a motif from the Americas.

Tim Simmons · 3rd May 2006, 08:28 PM

Look at the birds in this folk art painting from Mithila, modern day Bihar state, eastern India. The style strongly suggests an Indian origin.

Tim Simmons · 3rd May 2006, 08:33 PM

Even better match, where is Baden Powell and his chums?

Tim Simmons · 3rd May 2006, 08:37 PM

The bird thing on the knife has four legs?

Tim Simmons · 3rd May 2006, 09:11 PM

It could be a Griffon, they too have an Indo/Persian origin. The one on the knife does not have the traditional European influenced heraldic stance.

Tim Simmons · 3rd May 2006, 09:26 PM

The other bird thing has the tale of a wyvern, perhaps it is South American.

Just similarity in folk art.

Lew · 3rd May 2006, 10:16 PM

Hi All

I was one of the bidders. The knife is Spanish from the south or Italian from the Mediterranean. The stacked horn hilt is often seen on these knives and the bird is a spanish peacock.

http://www.photographycorner.com/for...ad.php?t=29201

Lew

Tim Simmons · 3rd May 2006, 11:11 PM

Lew, I think the bird like images are inspired by the mythical Griffon and Wyvern. Spanish Peacock

http://www.bird-breeds.com/Peacock.htm

Lew · 4th May 2006, 01:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tim Simmons

Lew, I think the bird like images are inspired by the mythical Griffon and Wyvern. Spanish Peacock

http://www.bird-breeds.com/Peacock.htm

Tim

The griffon has an eagle beak or head and the body of a lion or cat like creature. The bird on the knife has a peacock head but I think I see what looks like hind legs its hard to tell. Here is a link to another dagger with a stacked horn hilt. Seller claims its Mexican but I think its European.

http://www.collectorsfirearms.com/k28.htm

Lew

Tim Simmons · 4th May 2006, 09:54 AM

I think you may well right Lew. I like the depiction of soldiers? with plumed helmets on the other knife. I would have thought Mexican folk art would have some more native references in the decorative motif. The quality of the knife manufacture, the beauty of the naive art all add up to something special in my mind.

ariel · 5th May 2006, 02:59 AM

Lew and Tim,
Why do you think the one Lew shows is Spanish? The seller, who presumably had some info, called it Mexican. What ground do we have to disbelieve him?
The "Spanish" motives in the depiction of a soldier? Well, this is a very expensive knife, probably hunting and must have belonged to a wealthy man (likely proud of his European heritage). Do we expect him to have engravings of Mexican folk art? Pinatas? Aztec symbology?
Here is another one (just ended), defined as Mexican: stacked handle, flat-headed eagle pommel and engravings that have some resemblance to the arabesque engravings on the blade of the knife in question.
I see no reason Mexican artisans could not produce high quality knives with European motives.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...MEWA%3AIT&rd=1

Lew · 5th May 2006, 04:21 AM

Ariel

The knives I have seen even the nice quality ones from Mexico do not compare in quality to the knife in the link I provided. It might of came out of Mexico but it was probably imported from Spain. I think I saw a similar dagger in a recent thread within the last month or so. I will need to do a search on the forum.

Lew

ariel · 8th May 2006, 02:25 AM

Perhaps, Ernesto E. can help us: he is from Mexico.
Ernesto, are you around?

3rd May 2006, 01:37 PM	#1
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	Beautiful knife I am not into "Western" blades, but just could not ignore this one. I was not a bidder. This is likely Mexican (the eagle head is a giveaway). Look at the quality of deep engraving and the intricacy of the handle: Assadullah Cancuni http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...tem=6625415228

3rd May 2006, 08:33 PM	#6
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,807	Even better match, where is Baden Powell and his chums? Attached Images

3rd May 2006, 03:41 PM	#2
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,293	Hi Ariel , I'm not so sure this is Mexican work ; the motifs are atypical for the stuff that I have seen from our brothers South of the Border . It is indeed stunning work at any rate .

3rd May 2006, 06:00 PM	#3
Rich Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: comfortably at home, USA Posts: 432	I was looking at that knife myself, but it went to high for my cheap pocketbook :-) Not sure of the Mexican attribution, maybe Spanish or Brazil? Wild guesses there. Pretty knife whoever and where ever it come from. Rich

3rd May 2006, 08:04 PM	#4
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,807	My gut reaction from the decoration was India? just something about the bird. The scabbard is not very Indian? Saying that the bird appears to be a peacock with those little feathers on its head. I know a rich South American might have peacocks in his garden but it is not a motif from the Americas.

3rd May 2006, 08:28 PM	#5
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,807	Look at the birds in this folk art painting from Mithila, modern day Bihar state, eastern India. The style strongly suggests an Indian origin.

3rd May 2006, 08:37 PM	#7
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,807	The bird thing on the knife has four legs?

3rd May 2006, 09:11 PM	#8
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,807	It could be a Griffon, they too have an Indo/Persian origin. The one on the knife does not have the traditional European influenced heraldic stance.

3rd May 2006, 09:26 PM	#9
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,807	The other bird thing has the tale of a wyvern, perhaps it is South American. Just similarity in folk art.

3rd May 2006, 10:16 PM	#10
Lew (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: East Coast USA Posts: 3,191	Hi All I was one of the bidders. The knife is Spanish from the south or Italian from the Mediterranean. The stacked horn hilt is often seen on these knives and the bird is a spanish peacock. http://www.photographycorner.com/for...ad.php?t=29201 Lew

3rd May 2006, 11:11 PM	#11
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,807	Lew, I think the bird like images are inspired by the mythical Griffon and Wyvern. Spanish Peacock http://www.bird-breeds.com/Peacock.htm

4th May 2006, 09:54 AM	#13
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,807	I think you may well right Lew. I like the depiction of soldiers? with plumed helmets on the other knife. I would have thought Mexican folk art would have some more native references in the decorative motif. The quality of the knife manufacture, the beauty of the naive art all add up to something special in my mind.

5th May 2006, 02:59 AM	#14
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	Lew and Tim, Why do you think the one Lew shows is Spanish? The seller, who presumably had some info, called it Mexican. What ground do we have to disbelieve him? The "Spanish" motives in the depiction of a soldier? Well, this is a very expensive knife, probably hunting and must have belonged to a wealthy man (likely proud of his European heritage). Do we expect him to have engravings of Mexican folk art? Pinatas? Aztec symbology? Here is another one (just ended), defined as Mexican: stacked handle, flat-headed eagle pommel and engravings that have some resemblance to the arabesque engravings on the blade of the knife in question. I see no reason Mexican artisans could not produce high quality knives with European motives. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...MEWA%3AIT&rd=1

5th May 2006, 04:21 AM	#15
Lew (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: East Coast USA Posts: 3,191	Ariel The knives I have seen even the nice quality ones from Mexico do not compare in quality to the knife in the link I provided. It might of came out of Mexico but it was probably imported from Spain. I think I saw a similar dagger in a recent thread within the last month or so. I will need to do a search on the forum. Lew

8th May 2006, 02:25 AM	#16
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	Perhaps, Ernesto E. can help us: he is from Mexico. Ernesto, are you around?