Ottoman karabela XVIII

qusko · 20th November 2018, 11:53 PM

Hi,

I have bought following Ottoman karabela, which I think is from XVIII century.
Similar item is in Dresden museum (https://skd-online-collection.skd.mu...s/Index/289073) with following differences:
- hilt and crossguard
- blade in my item is more curved

In some other posts I've found it can be precursor of pala.
It also has a form of polish karabela type IIc, but ottoman origin.
Hilt with the blade is a little bit not typical..but possible

Can you share your opinion?

Kubur · 21st November 2018, 07:36 PM

Your sword is superb
I think you are right, its an Ottoman pala with a karabela hilt.
18th c. at least for the blade...
You should clean the silvers fittings and guard.
Congrats

fernando · 21st November 2018, 08:08 PM

Yes; a superb example indeed

.

qusko · 21st November 2018, 09:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kubur

Your sword is superb
I think you are right, its an Ottoman pala with a karabela hilt.
18th c. at least for the blade...
You should clean the silvers fittings and guard.
Congrats

Thanks

I like it very much and indeed some cleaning is required.
About the blade I have similar opinion that it's XVIIIc. I am just not sure if the rest (hilt/scabbard) is from the same period (despite all matches very well)

Oliver Pinchot · 22nd November 2018, 01:13 PM

Nice example. In Turkish museums, these short, broad blades are identified as
naval.

ariel · 22nd November 2018, 03:14 PM

Would not be surprised to see wootz blade. Pattern-welded at the very least. Etching a small window will give an answer, but it would be an easy task: no rusting, no pitting. Not sure about the fittings: on the photograph they look copper alloy to me. Again, a small area rubbed with silver-cleaning paste would direct you to their full cleaning or leaving them as is.
Outstanding example of a true museum quality! Congratulations!

rickystl · 22nd November 2018, 04:20 PM

While mostly a novice with blades, I just want to comment what a beautiful sabre this is. Outstanding looks. Congratulations.

Rick

qusko · 22nd November 2018, 09:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ariel

Would not be surprised to see wootz blade. Pattern-welded at the very least. Etching a small window will give an answer, but it would be an easy task: no rusting, no pitting. Not sure about the fittings: on the photograph they look copper alloy to me. Again, a small area rubbed with silver-cleaning paste would direct you to their full cleaning or leaving them as is.
Outstanding example of a true museum quality! Congratulations!

Thank you Ariel!
For the feetings for sure it's brass.

ariel · 23rd November 2018, 05:40 PM

Then do not touch them!

Shiny brass is vulgar, your patinated one is old, mellow and classy.

Kubur · 23rd November 2018, 06:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by qusko

Thank you Ariel!
For the feetings for sure it's brass.

Well i'm 99% sure it's silver, you should try in one small corner, on the non exposed face of the sword... Many people do this mistake old silver looks like brass sometimes.
I agree with Ariel if it's brass don't touch it.

20th November 2018, 11:53 PM	#1
qusko Member Join Date: Nov 2018 Posts: 55	Ottoman karabela XVIII Hi, I have bought following Ottoman karabela, which I think is from XVIII century. Similar item is in Dresden museum (https://skd-online-collection.skd.mu...s/Index/289073) with following differences: - hilt and crossguard - blade in my item is more curved In some other posts I've found it can be precursor of pala. It also has a form of polish karabela type IIc, but ottoman origin. Hilt with the blade is a little bit not typical..but possible Can you share your opinion? Attached Images

21st November 2018, 07:36 PM	#2
Kubur Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Posts: 2,145	Your sword is superb I think you are right, its an Ottoman pala with a karabela hilt. 18th c. at least for the blade... You should clean the silvers fittings and guard. Congrats

21st November 2018, 08:08 PM	#3
fernando (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,694	Yes; a superb example indeed .

22nd November 2018, 01:13 PM	#5
Oliver Pinchot Member Join Date: Sep 2012 Posts: 457	Nice example. In Turkish museums, these short, broad blades are identified as naval.

22nd November 2018, 03:14 PM	#6
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	Would not be surprised to see wootz blade. Pattern-welded at the very least. Etching a small window will give an answer, but it would be an easy task: no rusting, no pitting. Not sure about the fittings: on the photograph they look copper alloy to me. Again, a small area rubbed with silver-cleaning paste would direct you to their full cleaning or leaving them as is. Outstanding example of a true museum quality! Congratulations!

22nd November 2018, 04:20 PM	#7
rickystl Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: St. Louis, MO area. Posts: 1,623	While mostly a novice with blades, I just want to comment what a beautiful sabre this is. Outstanding looks. Congratulations. Rick

23rd November 2018, 05:40 PM	#9
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	Then do not touch them! Shiny brass is vulgar, your patinated one is old, mellow and classy.