Small Ottoman? Persian? Kard.

Battara · 28th June 2017, 07:34 PM

Thanks for the pics. I am now more convinced that the piece is Ottoman, but came into the hands of a Greek who took off the cartouche - a common practice among Greeks who got Ottoman pieces.

Sometimes the Ottoman and Indian kards are hard to distinguish due to trade and cross cultural influences.

mariusgmioc · 28th June 2017, 08:51 PM

In my oppinion there is no question about its authenticity as an Ottoman Bichaq. I don't see anything to raise suspicion.

I have myself one with a single piece silver scabbard as it was quite common.

Now, where exactly was it made is another issue. My bet is for Bosnia but it can also be Greece or even Turkey, as both smiths and crafts travelled freely within the Otooman empire.

I agree with Battara that it was probably made by a Muslim smith, and at some point the Turkish/Arab/Farsi cartouche was deliberately removed by a Christian Zelot owner.

PS: Regarding Kubur's question about the flowers... well, that's precisely why I supect it was made in Bosnia... or somewhere in the Balkans as opposed to continental Turkey where I would expect diferent type of decorations.

PPS: I might be obsessed but I would check the blade for wootz.

Battara · 28th June 2017, 11:49 PM

Most Balkan blades were not wootz, but I do agree with mariusgmioc. It would be a good idea to check for wootz or a pattern weld of some kind just in case.

28th June 2017, 08:51 PM	#2
mariusgmioc Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Location: Austria Posts: 1,903	In my oppinion there is no question about its authenticity as an Ottoman Bichaq. I don't see anything to raise suspicion. I have myself one with a single piece silver scabbard as it was quite common. Now, where exactly was it made is another issue. My bet is for Bosnia but it can also be Greece or even Turkey, as both smiths and crafts travelled freely within the Otooman empire. I agree with Battara that it was probably made by a Muslim smith, and at some point the Turkish/Arab/Farsi cartouche was deliberately removed by a Christian Zelot owner. PS: Regarding Kubur's question about the flowers... well, that's precisely why I supect it was made in Bosnia... or somewhere in the Balkans as opposed to continental Turkey where I would expect diferent type of decorations. PPS: I might be obsessed but I would check the blade for wootz. Attached Images

28th June 2017, 07:34 PM	#1
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,219	Thanks for the pics. I am now more convinced that the piece is Ottoman, but came into the hands of a Greek who took off the cartouche - a common practice among Greeks who got Ottoman pieces. Sometimes the Ottoman and Indian kards are hard to distinguish due to trade and cross cultural influences.

28th June 2017, 11:49 PM	#3
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,219	Most Balkan blades were not wootz, but I do agree with mariusgmioc. It would be a good idea to check for wootz or a pattern weld of some kind just in case.