Pameran Keris Kamardikan - Kamardikan Keris Exhibition 27 - 28 Aug 2016 - Page 2

satsujinken · 5th September 2016, 11:21 AM

more pics means more details !!

satsujinken · 5th September 2016, 11:30 AM

This is another keris, courtesy of Donny Yonatan, called Kanjeng Jiwana

the inspiration of the pamor is of course wood burl, meaning we must be like plants, the first to grow and the first to sacrifice so other living being may inhabit an area

basically humility and perseverance

enjoy

rasdan · 5th September 2016, 01:39 PM

The tambal pamor work is amazing. Thank you for sharing the photos Satsujinken.

Sajen · 5th September 2016, 04:51 PM

Thank you Satsujinken for all the pictures and this interesting thread!

But like David and some others I have problems to accept some of very outlandish looking pieces as keris.

Best regards,
Detlef

David · 5th September 2016, 05:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rasdan

The tambal pamor work is amazing. Thank you for sharing the photos Satsujinken.

Rasdan, were you referring to the keris in post #32?
It is beautiful, btw, but at the risk of displaying my ignorance it doesn't look like what i understand as pamor tambal.

A. G. Maisey · 5th September 2016, 11:43 PM

I thought that was tambal when I first looked at it, and I guess, in a way, it is tambal, but its a new approach, I think.

From what I can see and guess, it looks as if the pamor has been welded normally, but then the separating lines have been cut into the pamor and filled with strips of black material, probably steel, because of the lower weld heat required.

The forging has then been returned to the forge and another couple of weld heats put into it to fix the separating strips in place.

Of course, I'd need to examine this blade in the hand to confirm my guess, but however it was done, the effect is a new initiative.

I've said it before:- these blokes are amongst the world's best pattern welders. Maybe the best of them are the world's best pattern welders.

Jean · 6th September 2016, 10:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David

Rasdan, were you referring to the keris in post #32?
It is beautiful, btw, but at the risk of displaying my ignorance it doesn't look like what i understand as pamor tambal.

Hello David,
Rasdan and Alan are referring to the keris in posts #30 and 31 I think.
Regards

A. G. Maisey · 6th September 2016, 11:06 AM

Yes, the Bali one.

Strictly speaking "tambal" is a patch that mends something, but in this Bali keris the patches are not the pieces of pamor, the "tambal" is --- I believe --- the strips between the pieces of pamor:- look very closely at the way the grain continues from one island of pamor to the next, and then look even more closely at the junction between the black separating strip and the solid black border material.

I'd need to handle it to be certain of what I think has been done, but in any case, however it was done it is brilliant work.

David · 6th September 2016, 04:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jean

Hello David,
Rasdan and Alan are referring to the keris in posts #30 and 31 I think.
Regards

Thanks for pushing the point Jean and clearing this up. Rasdan's remark came right after post #32 which as i stated did not look like tambal to my eye at all which is why i asked the question. I became even more confused when Alan responded after my query specifically naming post #32 that he did indeed think it was tambal. I do agree that the Bali keris in post #31 does indeed look like a form of tambal.

rasdan · 6th September 2016, 08:38 PM

Hi David,

Sorry for my late reply. As suggested by Jean, I am referring to keris in post 31. It is just that at that time I think that the pamor bits are inserted into the baja, but upon closer inspection I think Alan is right, the baja are the ones that were inserted into the pamor.

A. G. Maisey · 7th September 2016, 12:24 AM

Sorry for causing confusion David.

I didn't check the post number because there was only one blade there with pamor that gave the appearance of tambal, and I mistakenly thought you were talking about that one.

My apologies.

satsujinken · 7th September 2016, 04:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

Yes, the Bali one.

Strictly speaking "tambal" is a patch that mends something, but in this Bali keris the patches are not the pieces of pamor, the "tambal" is --- I believe --- the strips between the pieces of pamor:- look very closely at the way the grain continues from one island of pamor to the next, and then look even more closely at the junction between the black separating strip and the solid black border material.

I'd need to handle it to be certain of what I think has been done, but in any case, however it was done it is brilliant work.

if you happen to drop by Indonesia and visit Jakarta, I'd be happy to arrange a nice afternoon coffee session with the owner

A. G. Maisey · 7th September 2016, 05:03 AM

Thank you for your kind offer, but I normally don't go to Jakarta when I'm in Indonesia, additionally, I'm back from Jawa only a few weeks ago, so it will probably be sometime next year before I go again.

But I will keep your offer in mind and contact you if I do go to Jakarta.

Thanks again.

5th September 2016, 11:21 AM	#31
satsujinken Member Join Date: Sep 2012 Location: Surabaya - Indonesia Posts: 199	more kembang separung keris more pics means more details !! Attached Images

5th September 2016, 11:30 AM	#32
satsujinken Member Join Date: Sep 2012 Location: Surabaya - Indonesia Posts: 199	Kanjeng Jiwana Keris This is another keris, courtesy of Donny Yonatan, called Kanjeng Jiwana the inspiration of the pamor is of course wood burl, meaning we must be like plants, the first to grow and the first to sacrifice so other living being may inhabit an area basically humility and perseverance enjoy Attached Images

5th September 2016, 01:39 PM	#33
rasdan Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Kuala Lumpur Posts: 368	The tambal pamor work is amazing. Thank you for sharing the photos Satsujinken.

5th September 2016, 04:51 PM	#34
Sajen Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Germany, Dortmund Posts: 8,779	Thank you Satsujinken for all the pictures and this interesting thread! But like David and some others I have problems to accept some of very outlandish looking pieces as keris. Best regards, Detlef

5th September 2016, 11:43 PM	#36
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,892	I thought that was tambal when I first looked at it, and I guess, in a way, it is tambal, but its a new approach, I think. From what I can see and guess, it looks as if the pamor has been welded normally, but then the separating lines have been cut into the pamor and filled with strips of black material, probably steel, because of the lower weld heat required. The forging has then been returned to the forge and another couple of weld heats put into it to fix the separating strips in place. Of course, I'd need to examine this blade in the hand to confirm my guess, but however it was done, the effect is a new initiative. I've said it before:- these blokes are amongst the world's best pattern welders. Maybe the best of them are the world's best pattern welders.

6th September 2016, 11:06 AM	#38
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,892	Yes, the Bali one. Strictly speaking "tambal" is a patch that mends something, but in this Bali keris the patches are not the pieces of pamor, the "tambal" is --- I believe --- the strips between the pieces of pamor:- look very closely at the way the grain continues from one island of pamor to the next, and then look even more closely at the junction between the black separating strip and the solid black border material. I'd need to handle it to be certain of what I think has been done, but in any case, however it was done it is brilliant work.

6th September 2016, 08:38 PM	#40
rasdan Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Kuala Lumpur Posts: 368	Hi David, Sorry for my late reply. As suggested by Jean, I am referring to keris in post 31. It is just that at that time I think that the pamor bits are inserted into the baja, but upon closer inspection I think Alan is right, the baja are the ones that were inserted into the pamor.

7th September 2016, 12:24 AM	#41
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,892	Sorry for causing confusion David. I didn't check the post number because there was only one blade there with pamor that gave the appearance of tambal, and I mistakenly thought you were talking about that one. My apologies.

7th September 2016, 05:03 AM	#43
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,892	Thank you for your kind offer, but I normally don't go to Jakarta when I'm in Indonesia, additionally, I'm back from Jawa only a few weeks ago, so it will probably be sometime next year before I go again. But I will keep your offer in mind and contact you if I do go to Jakarta. Thanks again.