That is the real Nimcha!

ariel · 4th March 2010, 12:04 AM

Just ended.
As per Elgood, this is what a real Nimcha looks like.
And the blade is laminated, to boot!

Gavin Nugent · 4th March 2010, 01:02 AM

Thats a very nice blade there Ariel, did you win it or at least have a go at it??

Gav

Dom · 4th March 2010, 02:30 AM

Hi Fox
you said ; "As per Elgood, this is what a real Nimcha"
... as far as my knowledge a Nimcha is a single-handed sword from northwestern Africa, especially Morocco, no ?

these swords could bear strong resemblances to the neighboring Arab saif or from Mozambique

As per as your picture that nice sword looks more "Qilich style" or might be a "Qilich-Shamiya style" at least

but as "Nimcha" I'm realy surprise, and .... I should need a training

à +

Dom

Rick · 4th March 2010, 02:35 AM

This really begs the question .
No ?

Jim McDougall · 4th March 2010, 04:16 AM

A great looking blade with the interesting expanded tip, which in effect is of the yelman tipped sabres of Turkic ancestry and this one looks very similar to the example in "Arms & Armour of Arabia" (Elgood, p.10, fig. 2.1). The one illustrated has the 'karabela' style hilt, and the blade is described as 17th-18th century.
The example shown by Rick illustrates that these expanded tip blades were well known in the maritime sphere of the Arabs from SE Asia to North Africa, with hilts reflecting local taste.

These blades were often remounted many times in thier working lives, and it is hard to say what style hilt might have been on this blade in earlier times. The hilt on this is clearly Ottoman of course and latter 19th century...it is interesting to see the upward swept quillons. The old blade has the partial dentated semi circle used by native smiths recalling trade blade marks of the 'sickle marks' of Styria and the Caucusus.

As far as the term 'nimcha'....it has of course become loosely applied to the Moroccan multiquilloned hilt swords of the 17th-20th century, apparantly somewhat incorrectly . Elgood notes that the term actually means nim =half and sha is also diminutive, suggesting it refers to a smaller type sword (many of the blades such as seen with this example are actually relatively small).
The Moroccan swords are typically mounted with all manner of full length trade blades, with many actually straight backsword types, so the term becomes confusing literally, however now commonly used by collectors.
From what I have understood, much like the 'kaskara' in Sudanese regions (a term unknown in the Sudan), these swords are termed locally as sa'if, the Arabic term for sword, and as Lee once so eloquently noted, were 'not otherwise specified'.

This 'nimcha' with what appears later Ottoman hilt may well have been remounted in third quarter 19th century with Ottoman reconquests in al Hasa and the Yemen

Intriguing blade with lots of character, and no doubt history to go with it.

All best regards,
Jim

ariel · 5th March 2010, 04:29 AM

Well, gentlemen, please look at this one
http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...ghlight=nimcha
that I posted quite some time ago.

Reminds you of something?

Rick · 5th March 2010, 04:44 AM

A cut down version of what you show in this thread ?

The fuller ends quite closely to the blade tip; this seems unusual on its own .

Gess · 12th February 2013, 03:53 PM

I will lift up an old topic

Arsenal Palace of the Grand Master, Malta, early 16th century.

Gess · 13th February 2013, 09:25 AM

Blade - the invention of the "Pirates of the Berber coast" many years the owners Mediterranean, later collected Barbarossa to the Ottomans. And of course, Nimcha - the correct name of a respected Ariel.
Pirat Nimcha

stephen wood · 13th February 2013, 05:31 PM

...some early nimcha or similar swords.

Iain · 16th February 2013, 01:02 PM

Great images - thanks for posting them Stephen.

These sort of depictions are invaluable and really do give a sense for how far back some of these forms dates.

4th March 2010, 12:04 AM	#1
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	That is the real Nimcha! Just ended. As per Elgood, this is what a real Nimcha looks like. And the blade is laminated, to boot! Attached Images

4th March 2010, 01:02 AM	#2
Gavin Nugent Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 2,818	Did you give it a go!! Thats a very nice blade there Ariel, did you win it or at least have a go at it?? Gav

4th March 2010, 02:35 AM	#4
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,293	This really begs the question . No ? Attached Images

12th February 2013, 03:53 PM	#8
Gess Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Russia, Moscow Posts: 44	I will lift up an old topic Arsenal Palace of the Grand Master, Malta, early 16th century. Attached Images

13th February 2013, 09:25 AM	#9
Gess Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Russia, Moscow Posts: 44	Blade - the invention of the "Pirates of the Berber coast" many years the owners Mediterranean, later collected Barbarossa to the Ottomans. And of course, Nimcha - the correct name of a respected Ariel. Pirat Nimcha Last edited by Gess; 13th February 2013 at 09:41 AM.

4th March 2010, 02:30 AM	#3
Dom Member Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Paris (FR*) Cairo (EG) Posts: 1,142	Hi Fox you said ; "As per Elgood, this is what a real Nimcha" ... as far as my knowledge a Nimcha is a single-handed sword from northwestern Africa, especially Morocco, no ? these swords could bear strong resemblances to the neighboring Arab saif or from Mozambique As per as your picture that nice sword looks more "Qilich style" or might be a "Qilich-Shamiya style" at least but as "Nimcha" I'm realy surprise, and .... I should need a training à + Dom

4th March 2010, 04:16 AM	#5
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,949	A great looking blade with the interesting expanded tip, which in effect is of the yelman tipped sabres of Turkic ancestry and this one looks very similar to the example in "Arms & Armour of Arabia" (Elgood, p.10, fig. 2.1). The one illustrated has the 'karabela' style hilt, and the blade is described as 17th-18th century. The example shown by Rick illustrates that these expanded tip blades were well known in the maritime sphere of the Arabs from SE Asia to North Africa, with hilts reflecting local taste. These blades were often remounted many times in thier working lives, and it is hard to say what style hilt might have been on this blade in earlier times. The hilt on this is clearly Ottoman of course and latter 19th century...it is interesting to see the upward swept quillons. The old blade has the partial dentated semi circle used by native smiths recalling trade blade marks of the 'sickle marks' of Styria and the Caucusus. As far as the term 'nimcha'....it has of course become loosely applied to the Moroccan multiquilloned hilt swords of the 17th-20th century, apparantly somewhat incorrectly . Elgood notes that the term actually means nim =half and sha is also diminutive, suggesting it refers to a smaller type sword (many of the blades such as seen with this example are actually relatively small). The Moroccan swords are typically mounted with all manner of full length trade blades, with many actually straight backsword types, so the term becomes confusing literally, however now commonly used by collectors. From what I have understood, much like the 'kaskara' in Sudanese regions (a term unknown in the Sudan), these swords are termed locally as sa'if, the Arabic term for sword, and as Lee once so eloquently noted, were 'not otherwise specified'. This 'nimcha' with what appears later Ottoman hilt may well have been remounted in third quarter 19th century with Ottoman reconquests in al Hasa and the Yemen Intriguing blade with lots of character, and no doubt history to go with it. All best regards, Jim

5th March 2010, 04:29 AM	#6
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	Well, gentlemen, please look at this one http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...ghlight=nimcha that I posted quite some time ago. Reminds you of something?

5th March 2010, 04:44 AM	#7
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,293	A cut down version of what you show in this thread ? The fuller ends quite closely to the blade tip; this seems unusual on its own .

13th February 2013, 05:31 PM	#10
stephen wood Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 227	...some early nimcha or similar swords. Attached Images

16th February 2013, 01:02 PM	#11
Iain Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Olomouc Posts: 1,693	Great images - thanks for posting them Stephen. These sort of depictions are invaluable and really do give a sense for how far back some of these forms dates.