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#1 |
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Location: PR, USA
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Any ideas? Doesn't seem to have any marks.
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#2 |
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Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 119
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im going to take a stab in the dark and say its french (or perhaps american)
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#3 |
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It was ID'ed as a French 1798, which it clearly isn't. This looks like a mid 19th C. blade. The crux of the matter, seems to me, lies in the strangely shaped pommel.
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#4 |
Arms Historian
Join Date: Dec 2004
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I agree with Manuel, the blade is typical mid 19th century cavalry sabre form as produced in Solingen (very much like that of the US M1840 "Old Wristbreaker"). Interestly, when that pattern was proposed, many of the first examples issued were Solingen products until Ames Sword Co. got production going.
As Chevalier has noted, the style of the hilt suggests American officers swords such as the M1852, and many. American military swords of the 19th century followed French patterns. The deeply canted pommel and the scabbard with single carrying ring, as well as the blade being of the Solingen form mentioned, in addition to the heavy bullion sword knot all together suggest to me this might be German. I dont have Bezdek or some of the references at hand to confirm that but hopefully someone out there in 'ID' land does ![]() If not German, possibly made there for export? |
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#5 |
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Location: The Netherlands
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I found a similar sabre in "Swords in colour" by Robert Wilkinson-Latham.
The description is: Russia, Sabre of the infanterie, model 1865. Typical is the strong bended end of the hilt, found on German and Russian sabres. |
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#6 |
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Hi Guys,
Was the pommel identical to the one on this example? Today, while browsing through the Old Swords Database, I was able to find a virtually identical sword, although in much better shape. They IDed same as a a Dutch M1852 Infantry saber. This is their data: http://www.oldswords.com/database/viewItem.php?id=9250 WHITE METAL HILT WITH FLORAL DECORATION CRACK TO POMMEL CURVED BLADE BY HORSTER, RIBBED HORN GRIP WITH WIRE BINDING WITH ITS BULLION KNOT. Further information provided: This particular saber was instituted in 1852 for all officers of Infantry / militia / rifle corps (jagers), to replace the former model 1820 epee general model, and as off the 1860s to marines. Original for infantery officers, the hilt was copper and for militia in silver. Officers of the riflecorps wore the same as infantry, however the hilt was gold plated and the blade highly decorated. These saber types are still in ceremonial use in changed design. From 1852 1880, the scabbard had two rings, afterwards the bottom rings was cancelled for ALL swords (excl some generals). The sword was replaced in 1895, except for the riflecorps and initially militia (abandoned 1907). Details Nation Dutch Arm Infantry Model 1852 Hilt Type Single Pommel Ball Blade 1 Fuller Circa 1852 to 1895 |
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#7 |
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Location: The Netherlands
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Celtan,
I doubt this sabre is Dutch. It has some similarities but it is a different one. |
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#8 |
Lead Moderator European Armoury
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Location: Portugal
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Have you tried to contact Jean Bink, Manolo ?
jeanbck@hotmail.com It appears that he knows a lot about (this type of) European swords. I am not revealing any secret by quoting his adress, as it figures in this Forum 'Ethnographic Edged Weapons Resource Site' . Fernando |
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#9 |
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Hi Guys,
No doubt whatsoever. This one is Dutch. The site has several swords and their pics, I compared them to mine and all the details are there. They state the sword is based on the Russian M1826. Also found a pic on Wither's book of a russian tsarist Infantry M1855 sword, very, very similar to this one, albeit the pommel was flat. I'll contact the guy nonetheless. Thanks! M BTW: Just changed the name of my image folder in Photobucket, so the first images may not load. The new address is http://s353.photobucket.com/albums/r...antry%20Saber/ Last edited by celtan; 25th September 2008 at 04:53 PM. |
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#10 |
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Location: The Netherlands
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Such a dutch sabre with no marks????
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#11 | |
Lead Moderator European Armoury
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Portugal
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![]() Quote:
![]() Aren't those two mark punctions, by the forte? Or am i getting senile before noticing it ? ![]() Can't you magnify those, Manolo? Fernando |
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#12 |
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Haven't found any marks so far. The two pictures were taken from the oldswords site, and are identical to my saber, right down to the portepee...
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Best M Last edited by celtan; 26th September 2008 at 11:31 PM. |
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