What kind of oil do you use for your blades?

[M ELEY]

For dry, damaged hide/leather or wood, like on hilts and scabbards, i find that linseed oil has an amazing way of re-lusturizing (is that even a word- ) the finish. Also works great on old gun stocks...
Anyone else try this product??

[ericlaude]

I agree, renaissance wax is the most for metal and wood

[Dimasalang]

Originally Posted by M ELEY

For dry, damaged hide/leather or wood, like on hilts and scabbards, i find that linseed oil has an amazing way of re-lusturizing (is that even a word- ) the finish. Also works great on old gun stocks...
Anyone else try this product??

Which Linseed do you use? The linseed topic is something I always wanted to bring up here on this forum.
I use "RAW Linseed Oil" on a few of my rifle stocks, and now have started using it on some of my wood handles and scabbards...RLO is NOT the same as "Boiled Linseed Oil". Many frown upon RLO because it takes forever to dry and it darkens wood too much where it effects their color preference, but IMO it looks the best and it is the oil that keeps wood from drying out and cracking. RLO was the original ingredient by most gun manufactures pre-WWII to put on their rifle stocks(priority being to keep them from cracking)...which is also why they have the nicer looking aged stocks that are darker and have greater amount of patina on them compared to post-WWII rifle stocks. BLO on the other hand is popular because it dries fast...but they do contain other chemicals and "dryers", as well as sealers...so BLOs from different manufactures can give different looks and textures. Because of all these chemicals in BLO, some companies that make wood playsets for children went back to natural RLO because some of them felt BLO contained too many chemicals for children to be playing with. Aside from drying faster, the other positive thing about BLO is that it hardens and seals the wood better which holds up better to rain and the elements...which personally I feel can defeat the purpose of getting that aged patina to grow(were not taking these aged artifacts out in the rain or leaving them outside anyways). Sealing wood is something you want to do for outside wood decks that would last about 5-15 maybe 20 years...Im not looking to do this for my wood rifle stocks or scabbards. BLO does better at locking out air and moisture(rain), which also means the wood can still dry out and crack...one big negative for me to not use BLO or any sealer, the wood will take twice as long to develop a patina OR will never develop a patina because oxidation can no longer occur. There is always a great debate around the C&R gun community about what to rub on wood stocks...BLO, RLO, and Tung Oil. Some gun owners have reported to seeing their stocks turn darker and start developing a patina by the 6month of adding RLO to their brand new rifle stocks. None of them stand up well to outdoor environments, but I don't drag my stocks threw storms or assault beaches either...so for me personally, I am aiming for that old aged look, RLO makes the wood look more aged(in my eyes).
Everyone has their own preference to using linseed oil, tung oil, sealers, etc... This is just my own preference/opinion which I know isn't for every body, and Im still learning to take better care of my pieces(thanks to everyone on this forum).

[Dom]

as oil, I used WD-40
and elbow grease

for cleaning, remove rust or spots
1) emery cloth
2) to smooth the emery marks, steel wool
3) application of metal polish "Briliant" as deep cleaner
4) application of wax polish "Renaissance" to allow manipulation without gloves, and prevent oxydation

I spread inside scabbards WD-40, that feed the wood, or prevent any metal oxydation

à +

Dom

[M ELEY]

I forgot about the raw linseed. I confess that I use the boiled linseed, but only on old, splintery stocks or damaged sheaths to seal their finish better. It works exceptionally well for this. Hmmm, will have to try the raw form sometime just to see the results.

[A. G. Maisey]

For polished bladesI use Renaissance Wax or Antiquax.

For blades with a rough surface like keris and other similar S.E. Asian blades I use a drench of WD40, allowed to dry on the blade followed by a mix of medicinal parrafin, kenanga oil and sandalwood oil.

For long term storage of rough surface blades I sometimes use light machine oil.

Any blade that I intend to store for any length of time is oiled, placed in a plastic sleeve, and stored out of the scabbard. Scabbards are for carry, they are not suited to storage of blades of any type.


Raw linsed oil and patience can work wonders on old cracked wood.

[kahnjar1]

Originally Posted by M ELEY

For dry, damaged hide/leather or wood, like on hilts and scabbards, i find that linseed oil has an amazing way of re-lusturizing (is that even a word- ) the finish. Also works great on old gun stocks...
Anyone else try this product??

Definately Raw Linseed Oil for wood, and although I have not tried it on leather, it should be OK there as well, as it is vegetable , and not chemical based.
As an aside, the old English gunmakers ALWAYS used linseed oil HAND RUBBED to polish up their gunstocks. What you see on those lovely old walnut gunstocks is entirely hand done!
Regards Stu

[M ELEY]

I knew I had read that somewhere (English gunsmiths using linseed). Thanks, Stu!
OK, so I used boiled, but should be using raw linseed. Now I just have to find some...

[kahnjar1]

Originally Posted by M ELEY

I knew I had read that somewhere (English gunsmiths using linseed). Thanks, Stu!
OK, so I used boiled, but should be using raw linseed. Now I just have to find some...

I don't know that it really matters if it is boiled or not. For Raw Linseed Oil
try a paint merchant (NON acrylic paint contains,or used to contain Linseed Oil) or good hardware shop.
Regards Stu

[Dimasalang]

Arts and Crafts stores carry RLO in small 8oz bottles. Artist use RLO to mix with their paint.

[fearn]

I love linseed oil too. It's got one problem though, which is that linseed oil on cotton rags can sometimes spontaneously combust, so make sure you dispose of it carefully!. I usually soap up the rags and dispose of them sopping wet.

Best,

F

[A. G. Maisey]

Thanks for that Fearn.

Just shows it doesn't matter how long you've used something you can always learn something new about it.

I've used linseed oil, both raw and boiled, all my life, as had my father before me, and his great uncle, from whom he learnt his trade, and I've never heard about this spontaneous combustion thing.

Do you know under what circumstances this will occur?

Ever seen it happen?

PS --- just googleised it. yep, its real alright. couldn't find anybody who had ever seen it happen, but according to the chemistry its possible, and manufacturers warn against it.

Again, thanks Fearn for bringing this to our attention.

[asomotif]

Cotton rags and any kind of grease or oil may start to "selfheat".
Same proces as in coal or a haystack.

If you combine this with metal dust or turnings that are left after drilling in metal, you can get a tricky combination for a fire.

Cotton rags with lineseed can also be laid down flat for the lineseed to dry before disposal.

Risk is the sum of "chance" and "consequence".
The chance of these rags selfcombusting is probably not that high.
But the consequence if you have left them in the garbage can in the garage and return after a days work...

[Albert]

For the metal parts I use Ballistol.

[A. G. Maisey]

Yes Paul, the gandar, and the gambar of a wrongko will absorb the oil that is put onto a blade. In the case of a wrongko that has no pendok, this oil will stain the gandar, and this is considered to be undesirable.

However, it is considered to be desirable, some would say highly desirable, for the gandar that is covered with a pendok to be permeated by the fragrant oil that is applied to the blade.

Wood is a cellulose material, and left in long contact with unprotected ferric material, it will cause rust. If the oil permeates the wood it lessens the rust causing properties of cellulose. In fact, a scabbard of any type of material is far from ideal as the storage place for a blade. In the case of keris, two of the most favoured woods for a wrongko are scented sandalwood and teak, especially burl teak, both these woods have high natural oil content.

I use scented oil on all my South East Asian blades, on keris and other items considered to be tosan aji, because it is considered to be the respectful thing to do, on other blades because I always have the scented oil that I use on keris, close at hand, and it is easier for me to use this than something else.

But I do not store unprotected blades in their scabbards (wrongkos) I oil all my blades and then I place that oiled blade into a plastic sleeve, usually I then store the plastic covered blade in its scabbard, sometimes I do not.

Where the blade itself retains the smell of oil even after it has been thoroughly cleaned, the material from which the blade is made will be found to be open grained and porous.



Albert

Ballistol, and a number of other oils designed for use with firearms do provide very good protection for any object made of ferric material, and that includes edged weapons.

However, when we are dealing with items of tosan aji, that is keris, tombak, pedang and other similar weapons from the Archipelago, it is traditional within these cultures, and most especially so in Jawa, to use scented oils.

For those of us who wish to observe the correct pattern of behaviour in respect of tosan aji, the use of oils other than those deemed to be acceptable within the relevant cultures is not really an option.

[Will M]

Birchwood casey Gunstock finish works very well for wood and dries fairly quickly. You can have it as a dull to gloss finish depending on coats applied and whether you rub it in to a gloss. Very little odour once dry and can be handled without any transfer. Scratches etc. can be quickly touched up.

[A. G. Maisey]

When I mentioned commercial finishes in post 54(?) Birchwood Casey Truoil was what I had in mind. I prefer to build up a number of coats with this, then take the gloss down a bit by using 0000 steel wool, followed by wax. Once again, the preparation is the key.

[Richard G]

I find that if you have a wood that is already finished but just needs a bit of smartening up a vigorous polish with a good quality BEESWAX based furniture polish will do the job.
For metal work I prefer Renaissance Wax, and if it possible, 'warmed' so that it can penetrate any pits created by rust. You can lightly buff this to a nice sheen.
Regards
Richard

[Dimasalang]

Originally Posted by kahnjar1

Definately Raw Linseed Oil for wood, and although I have not tried it on leather, it should be OK there as well, as it is vegetable , and not chemical based.

One thing that is a negative for RLO, because it is vegetable, it can rot leather and it can mold. So you have to watch carefully for this.

[A. G. Maisey]

Leather is best treated with preparations intended for leather, such as dubbin, or lanoline based leather nourishers and cleansers, or neatsfoot oil. Shoe polish is not a good preparation to use on old leather because of the drying agents in it which can worsen any cracking.

Wood treated with raw linseed oil is subject to formation of mold, but occasional rubbing with a couple of drops in the hand takes care of this. It is the unrefined solids in raw linseed oil that provide the patina.

A good fake hand rubbed finish can be achieved by using a gunstock finish like Birchwood Casey Tru Oil, lowering the shine with 0000 steel wool , and then hand rubbing with raw linseed oil. A genuine hand rubbed oil finish takes weeks of repeated rubbing to bring to a satisfactory finish, a faked up hand rubbed finish can be done over a weekend.

Neatsfoot oil is also the best preparation I know of for preserving tool handles.

[Interested Party]

Originally Posted by M ELEY

For dry, damaged hide/leather or wood, like on hilts and scabbards, i find that linseed oil has an amazing way of re-lusturizing (is that even a word- ) the finish. Also works great on old gun stocks...
Anyone else try this product??

Do you use boiled or raw linseed on the leather? To my understanding boiled has lead added to it as a drying agent and it seemed to have a long term negative effect on leather. I do like the boiled on wood as it doesn't gum due to the drying agent and you can use a finer abrasive.

Growing up in my grandfather's old school gun shop we used Rig on everything metal, but we dealt in European and American knives and fire arms. It did just fine on Damascus shotgun barrels and preserved case hardening colors nicely. That said I have been told that it would damage the temper lines on Japanese blades. I think the gentleman who told me that said he used magnolia oil. I live in the desert now and don't have to worry that much about rust. My preservation problem now is splitting wood.

[Philip]

Originally Posted by Interested Party

Do you use boiled or raw linseed on the leather? To my understanding boiled has lead added to it as a drying agent and it seemed to have a long term negative effect on leather. I do like the boiled on wood as it doesn't gum due to the drying agent and you can use a finer abrasive.

Linseed is the old standby for wood, not leather. For the latter, mink oil is highly recommended and I’ve followed that. advice for years with excellent results. It has a soft waxy texture not liquid.

Like you the presence of lead in boiled linseed oil is of some concern. If you cut raw linseed with gum turpentine that will help with absorption and drying. If you end up with a semi tacky film you can vigorously wipe with a piece of burlap to make a nice sheen that dries hard. Or you can later finish with your favorite wax.

[A. G. Maisey]

Boiled linseed dries more quickly, true, but raw oil seems to be a better filler, a lot slower to dry, sometimes finishes up a bit tacky --- which is not really a problem --- but the finished job, and I'm talking two years, not two weeks, looks pretty much the same. When I say that "tacky" is not a problem, I mean it can be easily fixed, it is not something that you need to live with.

The mildew problem is a characteristic of linseed finished wood. Yes, overall damp conditions certainly do generate mildew, but in premises which are not subject to a moist environment, a poorly maintained linseed finished gunstock can still produce mildew. I used to know of a lot of recipes for a hand-rubbed oil finish, and they can contain tung oil, mineral turps, gum turps, vinegar --- and other stuff I've forgotten. The preparation stage can get a bit mystical for some people. I've known people to use stuff like egg-white in the prep stage, and a lot of people swear by lemon juice and isopropyl alcohol in the prep, rather than steam whiskering.

The main thing with a hand rubbed oil finish is the way it is done, thorough preparation, warm wood, warm oil, tiny quantities of oil, completely dry between coats, rub back with 0000 steel wool between coats, spread the job over months, not days, buff the finish, wax over the oil finish. Some people prefer to use a cloth or hessian pad, others prefer no pad, others just use bare hand, you can generate more heat with a pad, and heat helps both drying and penetration.

I did a lot of stock work in my late teens and twenties, and have continued with spasmodic bouts of playing with firearm wood since then. I was taught how to do a hand rubbed finish by somebody who had a very solid background in this art, using boiled oil, what I was told was " a coat a day for a week, a coat a week for a month, a coat a month for a year, a coat a year forever" . I don't know that we can take that literally, but it is certainly the idea behind a decent hand rubbed finish. The thing with any oil finish is that it penetrates the wood, it doesn't sit on top of the wood like shellac, it goes into the wood and bonds with it, this means that if you have dings and dents in your stock it is a whole lot easier to get them out and bring the finish back than it ever is with something that just sits on top of the wood.

Oil finishes are never just a matter of slapping a bit of oil onto something, it is an art, and there are a number of ways to do the job. About 20 years ago there was a good article on oil finishing in one of the gun journals, I forget which one, but it was most likely Gun Digest because that's the only one I regularly buy.

[kronckew]

You CAN get proper BLO without the poisonous drying additives if you look hard enough. You can even buy edible flax seed oil (Flax oil IS another name for Linseed oil) from health food stores and boil it yourself, tho that may get interesting if it overheats, I bought some for use on wooden clubs from my local Hardware store. They happened to also be the local undertaker and coffin makers.

"A coat a day for a week, a coat a week for a month, a coat a month for a year, a coat a year forever" is also what I was taught many moons ago. works for me. After the first annual reoil, I turn 'forever' into 'as needed'.

They were/are quite traditional and preferred that for their hand rubbed coffin finishes. the tin specifically says there are no additives. It does take a LOT longer to polymerise and 'dry' without the additives.

In the late 19c Germany held a contest with a cash prize for anyone who could develop an all-purpose non-toxic gun lube and rust preventative. A gentleman won with his mineral oil based stuff, it could be used on wood stocks and does not dry out or harden or get tacky or sticky, it removes leading and copper fouling from the barrel rifling, lubricated the rifle moving parts, and prevented rust better than all the other entrants. It was non-toxic, and could also be used to lube moving parts on food prep machinery. It was found that it also was anti-septic and could be used to disinfect wounds and cuts, was anti-fungal as well, and could even be taken internally for a variety of illnesses (you can still buy a medical grade of it which is a bit purer, or a food grade version for fool machinery.) It's anise fragranced as anise oil is part of the formulae, some people like it, others do not. The Name of this miracle stuff is - Ballistol. It also doe not degenerate or break down over time, A tin of it can be left open for years and will be just as good as when made. Might get a few bugs in it tho, they can be strained out . Like anise flavoured Greek ouzo, it can be mixed with water, and turns a similar white cloudy look. tastes a bit like it too, but is not alcoholic.

For some reason I have not yet found the formulation sold in America has a slightly different formulation than the original still sold in Europe and the UK. Not sure what the difference is. Also useful for softening ear wax (Earwax is not recommended for use on wood or ferric metals )

[midelburgo]

I use arms grease. Antios or Armistol. It is there a year later.
Armistol has a nice kit with a dressing for wood.

I want to try lithium grease with some irrelevant blades.

[Helleri]

For a blade itself (it's fittings, handles and such not considered here) I use mineral oil. It's not a fast drying, relatively low inclusion/grit, has low free acidity, and is food safe.

Originally Posted by M ELEY

For dry, damaged hide/leather or wood, like on hilts and scabbards, i find that linseed oil has an amazing way of re-lusturizing (is that even a word- ) the finish. Also works great on old gun stocks...
Anyone else try this product??

Linseed (raw or boiled) while good for wood, can be bad for leather. It's a drying oil. Which means it has relatively high reactivity with oxygen that polymerizes it. While all leather will embrittle over time, regardless of treatment, linseed will speed that up. Especially in top grain, eventually forming unsightly crazing, and undesirable hardening.

As a leather worker my two best friends for conditioning leather are neatsfoot oil and bee's wax. Neatsfoot re-hydrates leather in a lasting and beneficial manner given that it is rendered from the shin and feet bones of a cow. So it contains a lot of the lipids, fatty acids, and glycerol compounds that the lather would have had as a living skin, or fresh out of the tannery but without treatment looses over time to dehydration. So it's a true restorative treatment for leather.

That said thinner and more paper like animal skin products, such as reptile hides (hides being different from leather in that they are cured and cleaned but not tanned) dry faster and require something that retains moisture better. Which requires very high glycerol content. So rose water is far better for those. Especially since it won't darken much which is undesirable for reptile skins (most reptile skins have high contrasts in the pattern that one typically doesn't want to become more muted through darkening).

Like most oils neatsfoot eventually dries. But does so a lot more slowly (can take weeks or months as apposed to days or hours). It's slow enough that when leather is rubbed with hand warmed bee's wax after application that it won't dry at all. As the bee's wax seals the surface from contact with oxygen. Beeswax also gives the surface a nice luster. It makes a handle a bit better in the grip, has a nice to somewhat neutral odor, and leaves far less residue on the hand.

If one feels at any point that they need to apply more neatsfoot. They can use a damp steaming hot wash cloth to remove the film of bee's wax. Allow it to dry for about 10-15 minutes (to make sure all the water has evaporated off the surface). Apply a new coat of neatsfoot. Then re-apply hand warmed bee's wax (rub it vigorously between the palms until it almost lathers).