On ethnography, hallucinogens, improvised knife, etc.

[aiontay]

My Kiowa ancestors came out from underground through a hollow log as ants. A pregnant woman got caught and that is why there aren't too many of us. On my Chickasaw side, we came from the west and ended up in the SE USA, before the Andrew Jackson repaid our help in fighting the Brits with him at the Battle of New Orleans by removing us to Oklahoma. For a rather interesting story regarding the Chickasaw migration legend, which was a common one in the SE, read Du Pratz's story of a Yazoo Indian who basically tries to find out if the story is true. Du Pratz was a French settler in Louisiana in the early 18th century, and his book is available online.

Which leads us to an Asian connection. Over here we say it was actually the other way around; you guys came from here (just kidding), and Du Pratz story indicates there might be a connection. My Kachin friends assert that their migrations legends lead them to believe that American Indians are their brothers. Interestingly enough, the linguist Sapir posited a link between the Tibeto-Burman languages and the Dine languages (Apache, Navajo, and tribes in Alaska and Canada). As for a link to the Philippines, the only link I can think of is that I've studied Pekiti Tirsia for over 20 years. Sorry, that's the best I can do. Oh, I like chocolate meat, which is a very Kiowa style dish.

As for my last sentence, their is a Kiowa Christian hymn "Son of God, the Spirit of Joy He Is" or that's how it is translated into English. It is my favorite hymn. A number of years ago a Kiowa man's wife died. One day not long after her death he was walking along a country road and passed a herd of sheep, animals not native to the Americas. As he passed by the herd, he realized they were singing a hymn. That is where that song comes from, sheep. As my Yuchi friend said when I told him that story, "See their own animals don't speak English!"

[fearn]

Originally Posted by aiontay

My Kiowa ancestors came out from underground through a hollow log as ants. A pregnant woman got caught and that is why there aren't too many of us. On my Chickasaw side, we came from the west and ended up in the SE USA, before the Andrew Jackson repaid our help in fighting the Brits with him at the Battle of New Orleans by removing us to Oklahoma. For a rather interesting story regarding the Chickasaw migration legend, which was a common one in the SE, read Du Pratz's story of a Yazoo Indian who basically tries to find out if the story is true. Du Pratz was a French settler in Louisiana in the early 18th century, and his book is available online.

Which leads us to an Asian connection. Over here we say it was actually the other way around; you guys came from here (just kidding), and Du Pratz story indicates there might be a connection. My Kachin friends assert that their migrations legends lead them to believe that American Indians are their brothers. Interestingly enough, the linguist Sapir posited a link between the Tibeto-Burman languages and the Dine languages (Apache, Navajo, and tribes in Alaska and Canada). As for a link to the Philippines, the only link I can think of is that I've studied Pekiti Tirsia for over 20 years. Sorry, that's the best I can do. Oh, I like chocolate meat, which is a very Kiowa style dish.

As for my last sentence, their is a Kiowa Christian hymn "Son of God, the Spirit of Joy He Is" or that's how it is translated into English. It is my favorite hymn. A number of years ago a Kiowa man's wife died. One day not long after her death he was walking along a country road and passed a herd of sheep, animals not native to the Americas. As he passed by the herd, he realized they were singing a hymn. That is where that song comes from, sheep. As my Yuchi friend said when I told him that story, "See their own animals don't speak English!"

Hi Aiontay,

You don't think that sheep would speak to Judean shepherds as well?

Seriously, though, I wonder if the sheep were humming, rather than speaking. People get their melodies from all over the place, and for all I know (and feel free to correct me), the person who wrote that Kiowa hymn was a shepherd who picked up his inspiration from the field.

Mozart did the same thing. He had a pet starling of whom he was quite fond. Starlings are mimics that can learn words, but Mozart put starling-like musical phrasings into at least one of his pieces.

Best,

F

[aiontay]

Hebrew or Arabic was the original language, of course, and plenty of ethnographic blades were used to prove that point. At least it was Semetic, and of course the animals understand it otherwise they would have gotten in the ark.

Fearn it was the words, not the tune. The hymn is 20th Century and there are still people alive who know the "composer" ( now deceased). He wasn't a shepard. The interesting thing to me is there are lots of songs attributed to animals in all the tribes, but they all pre-date Christianity as far as I know. Now there are plenty of Indian hymns that came via dreams or direct revelation, sort of like lots of medicines.

KukulzA28, Taiwan is a great place. I lived there for a year. Lots of interesting history.

[Gavin Nugent]

I'd love to write more but time is away on me.

Attached is a label attached to a quiver of arrows I passed by a week or two ago.

Gav

[fearn]

Originally Posted by aiontay

Hebrew or Arabic was the original language, of course, and plenty of ethnographic blades were used to prove that point. At least it was Semetic, and of course the animals understand it otherwise they would have gotten in the ark.

Fearn it was the words, not the tune. The hymn is 20th Century and there are still people alive who know the "composer" ( now deceased). He wasn't a shepard. The interesting thing to me is there are lots of songs attributed to animals in all the tribes, but they all pre-date Christianity as far as I know. Now there are plenty of Indian hymns that came via dreams or direct revelation, sort of like lots of medicines.

KukulzA28, Taiwan is a great place. I lived there for a year. Lots of interesting history.

Fair enough Aiontay, and thanks for the story. Hopefully I'll hear an Indian song next time I'm around a flock of sheep, whether or not I understand the words.

[migueldiaz]

Originally Posted by aiontay

Which leads us to an Asian connection. Over here we say it was actually the other way around; you guys came from here (just kidding), and Du Pratz story indicates there might be a connection. My Kachin friends assert that their migrations legends lead them to believe that American Indians are their brothers. Interestingly enough, the linguist Sapir posited a link between the Tibeto-Burman languages and the Dine languages (Apache, Navajo, and tribes in Alaska and Canada). As for a link to the Philippines, the only link I can think of is that I've studied Pekiti Tirsia for over 20 years. Sorry, that's the best I can do. Oh, I like chocolate meat, which is a very Kiowa style dish.

Cool!

Hey, I don't mind if we from Asia came from over there, via that Bering land bridge which is now Bering Strait.

I should probably mention that to the immigration officer the next time I visit the US. I'd like to find out what kind of conversation that will trigger

Joking aside, the study of languages is indeed heaven-sent with regard to tracing the migration paths of peoples, and as regards finding out who is really related to whom.

With the rise of high-speed computing in the 1970s, linguists were able to easily categorize gazillions of words, thereby providing additional leads in areas where archeology runs out of steam.

The Philippines' own language tree is below (from one of WH Scott's books).

For instance, it is one of the evidences being cited to prove that the dominant Taosugs of the Sulu sultanate actually came from the other side of Mindanao (the Agusan-Surigao area).

Now what I'm really interested in is a Phil. language tree with the time dimension, just like what was done (below) for the English language tree.

PS - Thanks for the reply-comments on the other points as well.

[aiontay]

Fearn,
Rather try to hear an Indian song, maybe you should listen for one meant for you; maybe it is out there. Mozart was on to something, and I wouldn't completely rule out those sheep speaking English, but in order to hear them, maybe to get on the right mental/spiritual level requires a lot of prayer and fasting. And listening to the birds sing, even if you don't understand their language is never a bad thing, but I'm sure you already know that.

Migualdiaz,
Just tell the immigration guys you're Navajo. I've had Navajo friends be mistaken for Asian by Asians.

To try to bring this back to the weapon angle, I've seen ceremonial uses of wooden knives and real gun in dances, but those weren't by my tribe, so I probably should leave it at that.

[fearn]

Originally Posted by aiontay

Fearn,
Rather try to hear an Indian song, maybe you should listen for one meant for you; maybe it is out there. Mozart was on to something, and I wouldn't completely rule out those sheep speaking English, but in order to hear them, maybe to get on the right mental/spiritual level requires a lot of prayer and fasting. And listening to the birds sing, even if you don't understand their language is never a bad thing, but I'm sure you already know that.

Thanks Aiontay,

I already speak more animal languages than human ones. It's fun.

F