Moro blades galore: Any gem/s here?

VANDOO · 24th October 2008, 07:40 PM

THAT WAS A FUN ROMP THRU THE SWORD SHOPS OF MANILA.

I AGREE THAT THE MAJORITY OF ITEMS APPEAR TO BE OF FAIRLY RECENT MANUFACTURE. NO DOUBT SOME BLADES AND FITTINGS ARE OLD ORIGINALS WITH NEWER ADDITIONS AND SOME MAY EVEN BE ENTIRELY ORIGINAL.
IT IS FUN TO HAGGLE IN SUCH PLACES AND I WOULD BE DISAPOINTED IF THEY DID NOT TRY TO SELL ME A BILL OF GOODS. BUT THE STORIES AND THE OLD THE GOOD STUFF IS IN THE BACK ROOM AND MY CHILDREN ARE STARVING IS ALWAYS FUN AND ADDS TO THE FLAVOR OF DOING BUSINESS IN SUCH SHOPS.

I SAW SOME ITEMS I WOULD HAGGLE FOR EVEN IF THEY WERE NEW.
THE THING TO DO IS
1. LOOK FOR THE QUALITY AND WORKMANSHIP OF THE ITEM (NOTE THE FILE WORK ON MOST OF THE KRIS BLADES IS POORLY DONE) THIS DOSEN'T NECESSARLY SAY IT IS NEWLY MADE JUST THAT THE MAKER WAS NOT VERY GOOD AT THAT PART OF THE JOB OR DID NOT CARE.
2. THE PERSONEL APPEAL IT HAS TO YOU REGARDLESS OF IF IT FOLLOWS A TRADITIONAL FORM EXACTLY
3. IS IT A FAIR PRICE

A WELL MADE OLD ORIGINAL KRIS THAT HAS SEEN USE WILL HAVE A GOOD BALANCE AND FEEL IN THE HAND. OFTEN THE BLADE WILL BE SHARP ENOUGH TO SHAVE HAIR OFF YOUR ARM. IF IT HAS BEEN TRICKED OUT WITH A BUNCH OF FANCY NEW FITTINGS OR IS A NEW BLADE THE BALANCE AND FEEL WILL USUALLY BE OFF.
FOR EXAMPLE I RECENTLY LET MY FAVORITE SWORD GO TO A PIRATE MUSEUM OF A FRIEND. IT WAS A 1870 U.S. NAVEL CUTLASS WITH BRASS GAURD AND WAS A DREAM TO HANDLE AND WAVE AROUND.

I MISSED IT AND SAW A NICE LOOKING REPLICA FOR A GOOD PRICE ON EBAY AND WON, IT LOOKS NICE BUT HANDLES LIKE A FIRE PLACE POKER AND IS NO FUN AT ALL.

I FIND IT VERY INTERESTING SOME OF THE NEW VARIATIONS THAT HAVE BEEN TRIED BY THE WEAPON MAKERS SOME ARE VERY FUNNY OR GARISH AND SOME QUITE APPEALING. WHILE ITS NICE TO JUST COLLECT GOOD ORIGINAL OLD TRADITIONAL FORMS, THE WELL MADE INOVATIONS ALSO HAVE A NICH AND ARE WORTHY OF COLLECTING IF THE PRICE IS RIGHT.

STORE #3 WOULD MY FIRST STOP

apolaki · 24th October 2008, 07:54 PM

i don't quite understand. these swords are made in the philippines by local craftsman where the swords originate. if they are modern creations, how are they any less? i mean didn't the person who posted these pictures say that one vendor is an actual maranao? if it's just a matter of age, i can understand that, but from a cultural ethnographic point of view, should they not hold the same esteem, antique & modern?

Thanks,

apolaki

ps - would so buy those lumad portraits even if they are modern!!!!!!!!!

David · 24th October 2008, 10:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by apolaki

i don't quite understand. these swords are made in the philippines by local craftsman where the swords originate. if they are modern creations, how are they any less? i mean didn't the person who posted these pictures say that one vendor is an actual maranao? if it's just a matter of age, i can understand that, but from a cultural ethnographic point of view, should they not hold the same esteem, antique & modern?

Apolaki, this is a valid question, but i am afraid that most of these modern pieces are made for the tourist trade, not with the same care, intention and level of quality that you will find in those actually made as true cultural weapons meant to be fought with by the Moro people. If you held them side by side you would understand the difference better. Certainly these are being made by local craftsmen, but it is sort of like buying a jazzed up tomahawk peace pipe from a Native American at a roadside Indian trading post somewhere in the Southwest states. It may actually be made BY an Indian, but it wasn't made FOR and Indian. Get it?

migueldiaz · 25th October 2008, 12:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by apolaki

ps - would so buy those lumad portraits even if they are modern!!!!!!!!!

apolaki, yeah why not?

in metro manila, tiendesitas (owner also of greenhills shopping center in san juan) would be it. in mindanao, i think aldevinco shopping center would have the most number of shops.

good luck!

kino · 25th October 2008, 01:17 AM

I would have fun there just looking around. There would be things other than edged weapons to separate me from my meager allowance.

Quote:

was able to etch the kampilan's blade last night, following the tips gathered from this forum. the blade's lamination has come out, and i'm going to post the pics of that kampilan on a new thread, to further solicit all of your opinions.

Miguel, what did you use as an etchant, I have heard that an unripe Balimbing works well.

Daghang Salamat for posting the photos.

migueldiaz · 26th October 2008, 12:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kino

I would have fun there just looking around. There would be things other than edged weapons to separate me from my meager allowance.

Miguel, what did you use as an etchant, I have heard that an unripe Balimbing works well.

Daghang Salamat for posting the photos.

Hi Kino!

I used kitchen vinegar as etchant, and following the tips given by Kai and Bill in this forum.

As for the use of 'balimbing', what I heard is that 'kamias' can be used. So I'll just try both.

Salamat! [thank you], also

migueldiaz · 26th October 2008, 03:25 PM

I've just gotten back from checking out the antique shops in the downtown (Ermita district) of the city of Manila.

I was looking for kampilans, and I've posted the pics of the five kampilans I'm choosing from, in this thread -- Five kampilans: which two to buy? Hope you can give me some guidance there.

As to what else are there in that popular antique store in Ermita, please see attached.

migueldiaz · 26th October 2008, 03:28 PM

Some more pics:

migueldiaz · 25th October 2008, 12:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VANDOO

THAT WAS A FUN ROMP THRU THE SWORD SHOPS OF MANILA.

... STORE #3 WOULD MY FIRST STOP

Hi Vandoo,

Thanks too for your opinion and tips. Much appreciated. I love this forum!

And Store No. 3 would really have the most interesting pieces.

I must also agree with you that half the fun in going over the swords (separating the thrash from the keepers) is precisely the dynamics of negotiating.

And if at times I would have successfully resisted that impulse-buy temptation, I also get a sense of smug satisfaction of how a 'good boy' I'd been

But for how long, who knows?

26th October 2008, 03:25 PM	#7
migueldiaz Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Manila, Phils. Posts: 1,042	I've just gotten back from checking out the antique shops in the downtown (Ermita district) of the city of Manila. I was looking for kampilans, and I've posted the pics of the five kampilans I'm choosing from, in this thread -- Five kampilans: which two to buy? Hope you can give me some guidance there. As to what else are there in that popular antique store in Ermita, please see attached. Attached Images

26th October 2008, 03:28 PM	#8
migueldiaz Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Manila, Phils. Posts: 1,042	Some more pics: Attached Images

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24th October 2008, 07:40 PM	#1
VANDOO (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: OKLAHOMA, USA Posts: 3,138	THAT WAS A FUN ROMP THRU THE SWORD SHOPS OF MANILA. I AGREE THAT THE MAJORITY OF ITEMS APPEAR TO BE OF FAIRLY RECENT MANUFACTURE. NO DOUBT SOME BLADES AND FITTINGS ARE OLD ORIGINALS WITH NEWER ADDITIONS AND SOME MAY EVEN BE ENTIRELY ORIGINAL. IT IS FUN TO HAGGLE IN SUCH PLACES AND I WOULD BE DISAPOINTED IF THEY DID NOT TRY TO SELL ME A BILL OF GOODS. BUT THE STORIES AND THE OLD THE GOOD STUFF IS IN THE BACK ROOM AND MY CHILDREN ARE STARVING IS ALWAYS FUN AND ADDS TO THE FLAVOR OF DOING BUSINESS IN SUCH SHOPS. I SAW SOME ITEMS I WOULD HAGGLE FOR EVEN IF THEY WERE NEW. THE THING TO DO IS 1. LOOK FOR THE QUALITY AND WORKMANSHIP OF THE ITEM (NOTE THE FILE WORK ON MOST OF THE KRIS BLADES IS POORLY DONE) THIS DOSEN'T NECESSARLY SAY IT IS NEWLY MADE JUST THAT THE MAKER WAS NOT VERY GOOD AT THAT PART OF THE JOB OR DID NOT CARE. 2. THE PERSONEL APPEAL IT HAS TO YOU REGARDLESS OF IF IT FOLLOWS A TRADITIONAL FORM EXACTLY 3. IS IT A FAIR PRICE A WELL MADE OLD ORIGINAL KRIS THAT HAS SEEN USE WILL HAVE A GOOD BALANCE AND FEEL IN THE HAND. OFTEN THE BLADE WILL BE SHARP ENOUGH TO SHAVE HAIR OFF YOUR ARM. IF IT HAS BEEN TRICKED OUT WITH A BUNCH OF FANCY NEW FITTINGS OR IS A NEW BLADE THE BALANCE AND FEEL WILL USUALLY BE OFF. FOR EXAMPLE I RECENTLY LET MY FAVORITE SWORD GO TO A PIRATE MUSEUM OF A FRIEND. IT WAS A 1870 U.S. NAVEL CUTLASS WITH BRASS GAURD AND WAS A DREAM TO HANDLE AND WAVE AROUND. I MISSED IT AND SAW A NICE LOOKING REPLICA FOR A GOOD PRICE ON EBAY AND WON, IT LOOKS NICE BUT HANDLES LIKE A FIRE PLACE POKER AND IS NO FUN AT ALL. I FIND IT VERY INTERESTING SOME OF THE NEW VARIATIONS THAT HAVE BEEN TRIED BY THE WEAPON MAKERS SOME ARE VERY FUNNY OR GARISH AND SOME QUITE APPEALING. WHILE ITS NICE TO JUST COLLECT GOOD ORIGINAL OLD TRADITIONAL FORMS, THE WELL MADE INOVATIONS ALSO HAVE A NICH AND ARE WORTHY OF COLLECTING IF THE PRICE IS RIGHT. STORE #3 WOULD MY FIRST STOP

24th October 2008, 07:54 PM	#2
apolaki Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 160	i don't quite understand. these swords are made in the philippines by local craftsman where the swords originate. if they are modern creations, how are they any less? i mean didn't the person who posted these pictures say that one vendor is an actual maranao? if it's just a matter of age, i can understand that, but from a cultural ethnographic point of view, should they not hold the same esteem, antique & modern? Thanks, apolaki ps - would so buy those lumad portraits even if they are modern!!!!!!!!!