14th-century samurai sword found in car at Swiss border

werecow · 2nd June 2022, 12:34 AM

€650000.... That's pretty steep!

Does anyone have more information on this sword and what makes it so pricy?

Curious if buyer / seller was someone posting or lurking on this forum.

ariel · 2nd June 2022, 05:56 AM

‘“Routine search”, my foot…
Swiss policemen with their exquisite expertise in Nihonto, “routinely” stopped and searched the car already in Switzerland (!) and immediately recognized that the sword was important and hugely expensive and not a “samauri scimitar “ made in China:-)
The transaction was obviously known in detail by the authorities, the car was marked and the search team was ready. Custom duties and sales taxes were substantial enough to justify the effort.
German and Swiss financial authorities must have good informants.

No way the participants were either members or lurkers on this Forum: we are far too small a fish to have even the smallest chance to get involved with six figure sums:-)

A. G. Maisey · 2nd June 2022, 08:23 AM

Maybe not quite so Ariel.

It is possible to buy a keris for $10 or so, but at the other end of the scale we are definitely into 6 figures in $US.

ariel · 2nd June 2022, 09:33 AM

Alan,
Yes, it is possible to buy a kris or any other stabber-slasher for $10 and sell it for $1,000, but I would venture to guess that no one of the Forum members ever sold or ( especially) bought a six figure USD sword. We are in a different league:-)

A. G. Maisey · 2nd June 2022, 11:24 AM

Ariel, I have never heard of buying a keris for $10 & then selling it for $1000.

But I have heard of & been involved with trade in keris that do sell for 5 & 6 figure US dollars.

US swords I know nothing at all about, most other edged weaponry I know very little about, but the top end of the keris market is something that I have had contact with for quite some time.

Japanese swords & etc I have had some slight contact with, although many years ago, I think I might have moved my last Japanese sword to a new owner about 30 years ago. It is a niche field and I realised that I just did not have either the time nor the intense interest needed to gain even a working knowledge in the area.

But I did have a lot of contact with specialist Japanese dealers and collectors over a lengthy period. Some of the values involved were quite exceptional.

ariel · 2nd June 2022, 11:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

But I have heard of & been involved with trade in keris that do sell for 5 & 6 figure US dollars. .

Alan,
I stand corrected. Congratulations and my hat is off to you. You are a better man than I.

fernando · 2nd June 2022, 12:50 PM

Perhaps because the whole story smells a bit funny, it gives place to legitimate speculations. A couple further details would make it appear more plausible.
The date and price mentioned may be realistic, but do lack support; that certainly not the sudden expertise of the Swiss Customs in the Nihonto universe.
They say they found an invoice; was it the one covering the sword purchase, and was it so detailed as mentioning such explicit elements; what for? Do you send your driver (and his daughter) transport a sword between countries, with such revealing document ? Why not sending no invoice or one describing a (replica) sword made in China (right, Ariel ?).
Definitely something doesn't square ... if i may

Maybe one of these days we hear further from the press on this, other than the initial 'breaking news' article.

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2nd June 2022, 12:34 AM	#1
werecow Member Join Date: Sep 2021 Location: Leiden, NL Posts: 553	€650000.... That's pretty steep! Does anyone have more information on this sword and what makes it so pricy? Curious if buyer / seller was someone posting or lurking on this forum.

2nd June 2022, 05:56 AM	#2
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	‘“Routine search”, my foot… Swiss policemen with their exquisite expertise in Nihonto, “routinely” stopped and searched the car already in Switzerland (!) and immediately recognized that the sword was important and hugely expensive and not a “samauri scimitar “ made in China:-) The transaction was obviously known in detail by the authorities, the car was marked and the search team was ready. Custom duties and sales taxes were substantial enough to justify the effort. German and Swiss financial authorities must have good informants. No way the participants were either members or lurkers on this Forum: we are far too small a fish to have even the smallest chance to get involved with six figure sums:-)

2nd June 2022, 08:23 AM	#3
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,991	Maybe not quite so Ariel. It is possible to buy a keris for $10 or so, but at the other end of the scale we are definitely into 6 figures in $US.

2nd June 2022, 09:33 AM	#4
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	Alan, Yes, it is possible to buy a kris or any other stabber-slasher for $10 and sell it for $1,000, but I would venture to guess that no one of the Forum members ever sold or ( especially) bought a six figure USD sword. We are in a different league:-)

2nd June 2022, 11:24 AM	#5
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,991	Ariel, I have never heard of buying a keris for $10 & then selling it for $1000. But I have heard of & been involved with trade in keris that do sell for 5 & 6 figure US dollars. US swords I know nothing at all about, most other edged weaponry I know very little about, but the top end of the keris market is something that I have had contact with for quite some time. Japanese swords & etc I have had some slight contact with, although many years ago, I think I might have moved my last Japanese sword to a new owner about 30 years ago. It is a niche field and I realised that I just did not have either the time nor the intense interest needed to gain even a working knowledge in the area. But I did have a lot of contact with specialist Japanese dealers and collectors over a lengthy period. Some of the values involved were quite exceptional.

2nd June 2022, 12:50 PM	#7
fernando (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,694	Perhaps because the whole story smells a bit funny, it gives place to legitimate speculations. A couple further details would make it appear more plausible. The date and price mentioned may be realistic, but do lack support; that certainly not the sudden expertise of the Swiss Customs in the Nihonto universe. They say they found an invoice; was it the one covering the sword purchase, and was it so detailed as mentioning such explicit elements; what for? Do you send your driver (and his daughter) transport a sword between countries, with such revealing document ? Why not sending no invoice or one describing a (replica) sword made in China (right, Ariel ?). Definitely something doesn't square ... if i may Maybe one of these days we hear further from the press on this, other than the initial 'breaking news' article.