Origin & Age

Jean · 30th May 2021, 09:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jean

Just a short comment about the origin of these blades: they were imported to Europe from Banten (or Blambangan according to Jensen) but is it certain that they were manufactured there?
There is a well-known drawing of the Banten port dating from the 17th century showing a kris-making workshop but is it a sufficient source of information?
Regards

Sorry, I should have said Banten and Blambangan, Jensen distinguishes the 2 supposed locations of origin, the blades of these krisses are very similar but the hilts look a bit different.
Regards

A. G. Maisey · 30th May 2021, 01:49 PM

Jean, I should have made clear that anything I have commented upon in respect of this keris is related only to the keris, from the Javanese point of view it is only the blade that is the keris, only the blade that is the Gunungan, only the blade that is the representation of Mount Meru, which is of course Mount Kailas, only the blade that incorporates the icons of Siwa and only the blade that provides a link to the ancestors.

All these other things that collectors consider as a part of the keris are not sacred, the hilt is a guardian, as is the wrongko. From the traditional Javanese
perspective these other things are similar to a suit of clothes, they might indicate where a complete keris, the dhuwung, was worn or used, but they do not indicate the origin of the keris itself.

This encapsulates the difference in the way I consider the nature of the keris and the way people like Mr. Jensen thought about the keris:- others like Mr. Jensen consider everything they see as giving some indication of its origin, I consider only the keris itself, that is to say, the blade.

Please accept my apologies if my failure to express myself clearly has caused any confusion. With this keris I have paid not the smallest degree of attention to the hilt, for me, the hilt is irrelevant.

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30th May 2021, 01:49 PM	#2
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,217	Jean, I should have made clear that anything I have commented upon in respect of this keris is related only to the keris, from the Javanese point of view it is only the blade that is the keris, only the blade that is the Gunungan, only the blade that is the representation of Mount Meru, which is of course Mount Kailas, only the blade that incorporates the icons of Siwa and only the blade that provides a link to the ancestors. All these other things that collectors consider as a part of the keris are not sacred, the hilt is a guardian, as is the wrongko. From the traditional Javanese perspective these other things are similar to a suit of clothes, they might indicate where a complete keris, the dhuwung, was worn or used, but they do not indicate the origin of the keris itself. This encapsulates the difference in the way I consider the nature of the keris and the way people like Mr. Jensen thought about the keris:- others like Mr. Jensen consider everything they see as giving some indication of its origin, I consider only the keris itself, that is to say, the blade. Please accept my apologies if my failure to express myself clearly has caused any confusion. With this keris I have paid not the smallest degree of attention to the hilt, for me, the hilt is irrelevant.