I know my Pappenheims...

fernando · 20th March 2020, 03:25 PM

Well, if this sword smith's intent was that of a deceiver, he would have better avoid to engrave that CLEMEN on the blade. For a newbie (like me) it is easier to suspect this is not the way CLEMENS STAM marked his blades than judge on the irreproachable technique this sword is made.
All this said by an ignaro, of course

.
A member like Jasper Smith would naturally have no doubts about it.

shayde78 · 20th March 2020, 04:12 PM

Thanks for the feedback so far, chaps.
I agree that seeing a maker's stamp that didn't correspond to a known stamp gave me pause. There may be another mark on the opposite side of the ricaaso, but because the plate guard is still intact, it is harder to see.

I also realized I didn't post any pictures that provide scale. The tiles on the floor of the next picture are each 12"x12". The picture of the hilt in my hand shows the proportions (at 6'4", my hands are not very small).

Also, one more detail that may help - I thought there were areas of delamination in the bars of the guard. Specifically, those that make up the area surrounding where the missing plate guard would be. Upon closer inspection, I believe this is an intentional groove into which the plate would be secured. See the third picture. Thoughts? Does this correspond to actual period construction practice, or just well constructed recreation?

ulfberth · 20th March 2020, 10:32 PM

Hello , it has one guard plate and the knucklebow missing, but it is one hundred % Original and it is a popular model rapier to, so congratulations !

ulfberth · 20th March 2020, 11:18 PM

its obviously a stabbing blade , can you tell me the total length including the guard , it looks like the blade is a bit short. Despite the name on the ricasso the style and geometry of the blade looks Italian.

shayde78 · 21st March 2020, 12:37 AM

Thanks ulfberth!
The total length is 41.75"
The blade, from point to guard (excluding ricasso) is 34".
I'm also trying to make out the word on the other side of the ricasso. I think I see K E Y, or K E X, but there are more letters I can't yet decipher.

ulfberth · 21st March 2020, 09:03 AM

that means its is missing 6 to 9 inch of its length, can you take a picture of the other letters ?
The name or word is interesting but in this case it could be they were used as a quality label .
The gripwire has also been replaced by cord and it's missing one Turkish knot, still an original pappenheimer rapier an a rare find ! Considering that many of them were restored at some point in time.

fernando · 21st March 2020, 12:51 PM

Excelent inputs Dirk; good to have you around

.

shayde78 · 23rd March 2020, 03:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ulfberth

The gripwire has also been replaced by cord and it's missing one Turkish knot, still an original pappenheimer rapier an a rare find !

So, upon taking a closer look, the grip appears to be wrapped, not in cord, but in a woven textile material that has been dipped in something like pitch(?). I'm attaching close-ups where you can clearly see the woven pattern. Is this at all typical of a period replacement?

20th March 2020, 04:12 PM	#2
shayde78 Member Join Date: Mar 2017 Posts: 445	Thanks for the feedback so far, chaps. I agree that seeing a maker's stamp that didn't correspond to a known stamp gave me pause. There may be another mark on the opposite side of the ricaaso, but because the plate guard is still intact, it is harder to see. I also realized I didn't post any pictures that provide scale. The tiles on the floor of the next picture are each 12"x12". The picture of the hilt in my hand shows the proportions (at 6'4", my hands are not very small). Also, one more detail that may help - I thought there were areas of delamination in the bars of the guard. Specifically, those that make up the area surrounding where the missing plate guard would be. Upon closer inspection, I believe this is an intentional groove into which the plate would be secured. See the third picture. Thoughts? Does this correspond to actual period construction practice, or just well constructed recreation? Attached Images Last edited by shayde78; 20th March 2020 at 05:44 PM.

21st March 2020, 12:37 AM	#5
shayde78 Member Join Date: Mar 2017 Posts: 445	Thanks ulfberth! The total length is 41.75" The blade, from point to guard (excluding ricasso) is 34". I'm also trying to make out the word on the other side of the ricasso. I think I see K E Y, or K E X, but there are more letters I can't yet decipher. Last edited by shayde78; 21st March 2020 at 03:11 AM.

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20th March 2020, 03:25 PM	#1
fernando (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,694	Well, if this sword smith's intent was that of a deceiver, he would have better avoid to engrave that CLEMEN on the blade. For a newbie (like me) it is easier to suspect this is not the way CLEMENS STAM marked his blades than judge on the irreproachable technique this sword is made. All this said by an ignaro, of course . A member like Jasper Smith would naturally have no doubts about it.

20th March 2020, 10:32 PM	#3
ulfberth Member Join Date: Jul 2014 Posts: 426	Hello , it has one guard plate and the knucklebow missing, but it is one hundred % Original and it is a popular model rapier to, so congratulations !

20th March 2020, 11:18 PM	#4
ulfberth Member Join Date: Jul 2014 Posts: 426	its obviously a stabbing blade , can you tell me the total length including the guard , it looks like the blade is a bit short. Despite the name on the ricasso the style and geometry of the blade looks Italian.

21st March 2020, 09:03 AM	#6
ulfberth Member Join Date: Jul 2014 Posts: 426	that means its is missing 6 to 9 inch of its length, can you take a picture of the other letters ? The name or word is interesting but in this case it could be they were used as a quality label . The gripwire has also been replaced by cord and it's missing one Turkish knot, still an original pappenheimer rapier an a rare find ! Considering that many of them were restored at some point in time.

21st March 2020, 12:51 PM	#7
fernando (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,694	Excelent inputs Dirk; good to have you around .