BLING

Roland_M · 28th May 2018, 03:24 PM

Alan,

thank you very much for your comprehensive explanation. Your wisdom and knowledge always impresses me!

Roland

Sajen · 28th May 2018, 04:49 PM

Thank you Alan for sharing!

The dress maybe more recent, probably is, but the Balinese ethic in respect of keris dress is very considerably different to the tastes of collectors in the world outside Bali.

This I can confirm! When I have had some years ago the privilege to see the private collection of a Balinese he noticed that the blade of a short pedang get rust because the blade has had contact with the beautiful antique scabbard. He told me that he will throw away this scabbard and will order a new one for his pedang.

It's a nice story which show the local value of an antique scabbard for a Balinese.

mariusgmioc · 28th May 2018, 04:58 PM

If I like these kerises... a lot, does it make me royal?! At least in tastes?!

Roland_M · 28th May 2018, 05:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mariusgmioc

If I like these kerises... a lot, does it make me royal?! At least in tastes?!

In this case royal means it comes from a royal aristocratic family and this got nothing to do with personal taste.

A royal Keris can be recognised by his level of artwork and amount of gold.

As far as i know, in ancient times gold was only allowed to aristocratic members of the society. Or as a gift from the aristocracy/nobility for important "normal" people (small amount of gold) or as a gift for other royals/high army representatives from all over the world (often a lot of gold).

Roland

Battara · 28th May 2018, 06:36 PM

I LOVE THE BLING! The beauty and artwork...........

Perhaps it is also because I am part Filipino. Like the Balinese, Filipinos and Moros love their bling (and they are cousins to all Indonesians).

A. G. Maisey · 28th May 2018, 10:38 PM

As to personal tastes in respect of the bling factor.

Almost 30 years ago I was fortunate enough to acquire two royal keris that had been the property of the Raja of Badung. They were not quite as exuberant as the the ones that are shown here in my photos, but both had more than enough gold to make them unmistakable for what they are.

Both these keris always had a very unsettling effect on me. I was uncomfortable handling them, and essentially all I ever did was to maintain and store them.

A few years ago I sold one of these keris, I still have the other.

I am a little more comfortable with slightly less prestigious keris also.

A. G. Maisey · 28th May 2018, 10:52 PM

Sajen, I have found that keris literate people in both Bali and Jawa are very well aware of the monetary value of old dress for tosan aji, even down to the value of a single face for a gandar. Even broken wrongko atasans have a value if the material is of very high quality, as most standard Javanese wrongkos can be carved into different forms.

Part of the maintenance process for keris in both Jawa and Bali is that scabbards are periodically cleaned out with a segrek. Over time this results in the scabbard becoming too loose and the mouth of the scabbard needs to be relined to give a close fit to the blade. Dress for keris in particular is regularly changed to reflect the changing circumstances of an owner, or for other reasons. One of the repeated stories I have heard is the dream of the old man asking for new clothes, or a new wife.

One of the advantages of a keris that uses a pendok is that the gandar can be a separate, much lower quality wood. This permits the gandar being changed instead of cleaned, which means the atasan can be cleaned from the bottom instead of the top, and the mouth does not deteriorate so quickly.

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28th May 2018, 03:24 PM	#1
Roland_M Member Join Date: Aug 2014 Location: Germany Posts: 525	Alan, thank you very much for your comprehensive explanation. Your wisdom and knowledge always impresses me! Roland

28th May 2018, 04:49 PM	#2
Sajen Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Germany, Dortmund Posts: 9,165	Thank you Alan for sharing! The dress maybe more recent, probably is, but the Balinese ethic in respect of keris dress is very considerably different to the tastes of collectors in the world outside Bali. This I can confirm! When I have had some years ago the privilege to see the private collection of a Balinese he noticed that the blade of a short pedang get rust because the blade has had contact with the beautiful antique scabbard. He told me that he will throw away this scabbard and will order a new one for his pedang. It's a nice story which show the local value of an antique scabbard for a Balinese.

28th May 2018, 04:58 PM	#3
mariusgmioc Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Location: Austria Posts: 1,906	If I like these kerises... a lot, does it make me royal?! At least in tastes?!

28th May 2018, 06:36 PM	#5
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,272	I LOVE THE BLING! The beauty and artwork........... Perhaps it is also because I am part Filipino. Like the Balinese, Filipinos and Moros love their bling (and they are cousins to all Indonesians).

28th May 2018, 10:38 PM	#6
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,991	As to personal tastes in respect of the bling factor. Almost 30 years ago I was fortunate enough to acquire two royal keris that had been the property of the Raja of Badung. They were not quite as exuberant as the the ones that are shown here in my photos, but both had more than enough gold to make them unmistakable for what they are. Both these keris always had a very unsettling effect on me. I was uncomfortable handling them, and essentially all I ever did was to maintain and store them. A few years ago I sold one of these keris, I still have the other. I am a little more comfortable with slightly less prestigious keris also.

28th May 2018, 10:52 PM	#7
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,991	Sajen, I have found that keris literate people in both Bali and Jawa are very well aware of the monetary value of old dress for tosan aji, even down to the value of a single face for a gandar. Even broken wrongko atasans have a value if the material is of very high quality, as most standard Javanese wrongkos can be carved into different forms. Part of the maintenance process for keris in both Jawa and Bali is that scabbards are periodically cleaned out with a segrek. Over time this results in the scabbard becoming too loose and the mouth of the scabbard needs to be relined to give a close fit to the blade. Dress for keris in particular is regularly changed to reflect the changing circumstances of an owner, or for other reasons. One of the repeated stories I have heard is the dream of the old man asking for new clothes, or a new wife. One of the advantages of a keris that uses a pendok is that the gandar can be a separate, much lower quality wood. This permits the gandar being changed instead of cleaned, which means the atasan can be cleaned from the bottom instead of the top, and the mouth does not deteriorate so quickly.