Sawfish sword

[Ian]

Well said Barry.

Originally Posted by VANDOO

I OF COURSE AM NOT AND DO NOT CLAIM TO BE AN EXPERT OR AN ACADEMIC BUT JUST A LONG TIME COLLECTOR WHO LOVES COLLECTING AND LEARNING ABOUT THE ITEMS I COLLECT AND THE SOCIETY'S WHO MADE AND USED THEM.
THEREFORE IN ACADEMICIAN CIRCLES NOTHING I OBSERVE OR SAY IS PERTINENT OR TO BE TAKEN SERIOUSLY. PERHAPS MY MEASUREMENTS OF AN ITEM AND PICTURES WOULD BE ACCEPTABLE AS AN INVENTORY BUT LITTLE ELSE.
ACADEMIA IS UNDER THE STRICT CONSTRAINTS THAT EVERYTHING MUST BE PROVENIENCED IN THE SAME APPROVED ARTICLES AND SCIENTIFIC PAPERS THAT ALL USE. DRAWINGS AND TEXT FROM SOME OF THE FAMOUS EXPEDITIONS SUCH AS COOKS EXPEDITIONS ARE ACCEPTED. BUT COOK AND OTHER ACCEPTED SOURCES SURELY DIDN'T SEE EVERYTHING OR LEARN ALL THE STORIES AND BELIEFS THAT MAY HAVE WENT WITH THE ITEMS THEY BROUGHT BACK. MOST SOCIETY'S DO NOT OPENLY SHARE THEIR BELIEFS OR STORIES WITH STRANGERS AND MANY OF THESE EXPEDITIONS DID NOT STAY LONG ENOUGH TO LEARN THE LANGUAGE OR GAIN THE TRUST AND ACCEPTANCE OF THE TRIBES EVEN IF THEY WISHED TO.
I LIKE AND ENJOY THE LORE, STORIES AND SPECULATION AND CONJECTURE USING LOGIC AND COMPARISONS TO OTHER SOCIETIES. THIS CAN NOT BE USED IN ACADEMIC CIRCLES DUE TO THE RULES AND THE CURRENT ACCEPTED FACTS AND PAPERS AND MAY BE LOOKED DOWN ON. BUT I FIND THAT A BIT TOO CONSTRAINED AND LACKING IN INTEREST MANY TIMES SO WOULD PREFER TO HEAR OR READ THE LORE WHICH IS USUALLY MORE INTERESTING.

I THINK THERE IS ROOM FOR BOTH BUT IT IS IMPORTANT TO KEEP THEM SEPARATE AS TO WHAT CAN BE PROVED AND WHAT IS SPECULATION OR LORE. AN OBJECT SUCH AS THE SAWFISH WEAPONS WE DISCUSS HERE ARE SURE TO HAVE HAD MANY STORIES AND LORE ASSOCIATED WITH THEM BY THE PEOPLE WHO MADE AND USED THEM. THIS IS LOST OR UNDOCUMENTED BUT BE SURE IT IS LIKELY AS, SUPERSTITION, MAGIC , MANNA AND TABOOS ALL HAD PARTS IN THE HISTORY OF THESE OBJECTS. UNFORTUNATELY EVEN IF THE LORE IS STILL TOLD IT IS NOT ACCEPTABLE IN ACADEMIA. ANTHROPOLOGICAL PAPERS POINT TO THESE BELIEFS AND LORE BUT USUALLY CAN'T BE PROVED. SO WE WILL HAVE TO DO THE BEST WE CAN UNTIL THE TIME MACHINE IS AVAILABLE.

[Tim Simmons]

More in the American Museum of Natural history.

I copy and paste the blurb.

SWORD, TWO HANDLE
PACIFIC ETHNOGRAPHIC COLLECTION

Catalog No: ST/ 1716
Locale: NEW GUINEA
Region: MELANESIA
Country: PAPUA NEW GUINEA?/INDONESIA?
Date: Late 19th Century A.D.
Material: BONE (SAW FISH)
Acquisition Year: 1895 [PURCHASE]
Donor: STURGIS, APPLETON
Keywords: SWORD

[Tim Simmons]

Pigorini Museum Rome.

[ariel]

That’s exactly what I was talking about: a tribal fighter with a weapon made from the only material available to him. This is a perfectly genuine and legitimate example well deserving careful consideration.

P.S. Unfortunately I could not find even an electronic form of a full English version of the paper by Mr. Miloserdov published in Armi Antiche. Perhaps the author could post here a scan of it for our information and subsequent discussion. In the absense of such we are limited to the preliminary Russian version published on an informal Russian forum in 2014 as well as the title and the abstract ( both in English) published in the Italian journal in 2016.