Two new Gunongs

[Battara]

Greetings.

The first one I would agree with your age assessment. Yes the fittings are indeed aluminum.

Your second one I might place between the 1920s-30s. The metal fittings look to be silver over copper (I see copper remnants).

It looks like you are becoming a gunong collector - fascinating aren't they?

[Sajen]

Originally Posted by Battara

Your second one I might place between the 1920s-30s. The metal fittings look to be silver over copper (I see copper remnants).

Hello Jose,

I would kindly and carefully disagree with you. The sharp and pointy luks, the okir at the fittings and the silver plating let me think that this gunong is younger as the the one with the aluminium fittings. But like always I could be wrong.

Best regards,
Detlef

[Sajen]

Hello Leif,

two very nice additions to your growing collection. The big one one with the broad blade and aluminium fittings is a real beauty. I really like this type of gunong with the very nice okir engravings on the blade and this eye-catching bulky ferrule worked from horn, bakalite (I am also not sure about the used material here) and aluminium. When I am you I would polish the aluminium fittings at the scabbard, you can get them very shiny, look to my thread ( http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...ghlight=gunong) post #8, I've used fine steel wool with metal polish.

The other one is like said in my opinion later but has a very nice blade. Be careful with polishing the fittings that you don't rub away the silver plating.

You assembled a nice collection of gunongs there, I would be happy when I could add each piece to my own collection!

Best regards,
Detlef

[kai]

I would be happy when I could add each piece to my own collection!

Hey, that's my line, Detlef!


Hello Leif,

Thanks for posting these nice additions to your collection!

I also especially like the large one. It seems that also the aluminium was (silver?)-plated; I'm not sure what is needed to plate aluminium - that may help to narrow down the time frame.

While I usually am not that fond of pointy luk, this blade does look crafted really well. I'd love to see the blade stained - if laminated, the pattern may confirm that it was forged to shape rather than done by stock removal! BTW, I believe the hilt will look even better if you keep nourishing the wood over several weeks.

Regards,
Kai

[Sajen]

Originally Posted by kai

It seems that also the aluminium was (silver?)-plated; I'm not sure what is needed to plate aluminium..

Hello Kai,

I doubt that it was ever silver plated. And the only way I am aware to silver-plate aluminium is electroplating. And I don't think that it was a used technic to this time.

Regards,
Detlef

[kai]

Hello Detlef,

I doubt that it was ever silver plated. And the only way I am aware to silver-plate aluminium is electroplating. And I don't think that it was a used technic to this time.

Maybe we rather have to adjust the estimated time frame?

Have a look at pic #14 (the tip/finial fixed with the copper nails): This looks like 2 metals to me and any other metal plating on aluminium is even more unlikely IMHO. Quality gunong have been produced throughout the 20th century, and contrary to many other ethnographic blades quality is not per se correlated with age. The dagger certainly seems to have some age - I don't have any data on the earliest examples of this style though. Maybe just the scabbard got replaced later? (Craftsmanship of the scabbard does look a bit subpar compared to the dagger IMVHO.)

Regards,
Kai

[Rafngard]

Thank you all for you kind comments.

There were a few I wanted to respond to

Originally Posted by kai

BTW, I believe the hilt will look even better if you keep nourishing the wood over several weeks.

Hello Kai,

I'm not quite sure what this process would involve. I don't suppose there's a thread somewhere that explains this process?

Originally Posted by kai

I also especially like the large one. It seems that also the aluminium was (silver?)-plated; I'm not sure what is needed to plate aluminium

It actually looks a bit more like, maybe corrosion? in person. But I'm far from an expert, but I could be wrong.

Originally Posted by Battara

Your second one I might place between the 1920s-30s. The metal fittings look to be silver over copper (I see copper remnants).

It looks like you are becoming a gunong collector - fascinating aren't they?

Hello Battara

Yes, silver over copper makes sense. I hadn't noticed the copper tones before. It's amazing what photos can bring out.

And yeah, the gunong bug has definitely bit. I love these things.

Originally Posted by Sajen

You assembled a nice collection of gunongs there, I would be happy when I could add each piece to my own collection!

Hello Detlef,

I think this high praise indeed! Thanks!

Originally Posted by Sajen

When I am you I would polish the aluminium fittings at the scabbard, you can get them very shiny, look to my thread [...] post #8, I've used fine steel wool with metal polish.

You know, it never occurred to me to try to polish the aluminium. I'll have to give this a try when I find some time.

Thanks,
Leif

[Battara]

Originally Posted by Sajen

Hello Jose,

I would kindly and carefully disagree with you. The sharp and pointy luks, the okir at the fittings and the silver plating let me think that this gunong is younger as the the one with the aluminium fittings. But like always I could be wrong.

Best regards,
Detlef

Detlev, I actually should have added the words "at the earliest" because, although I do think that it is a little earlier than the aluminum one, you are right in that it is not a very old one at all.

[David]

Originally Posted by Battara

Detlev, I actually should have added the words "at the earliest" because, although I do think that it is a little earlier than the aluminum one, you are right in that it is not a very old one at all.

Interesting. I would think just the opposite, the the curvy blade is actually the newer one. I would think that the earliest that one would be in the 1960's, though it could be later that that. With those pointy luks and the quality of that metal work there is no way this is a pre-WWII blade.
The other one is certainly post WWII. I would think maybe 1950-70s.

[Ian]

David:

I agree with your observations. Both are second half of 20th C, no earlier than 1960s and probably later.

Ian.

Originally Posted by David

Interesting. I would think just the opposite, the the curvy blade is actually the newer one. I would think that the earliest that one would be in the 1960's, though it could be later that that. With those pointy luks and the quality of that metal work there is no way this is a pre-WWII blade.
The other one is certainly post WWII. I would think maybe 1950-70s.

[Battara]

I guess I was thinking of my Datu Piang kris with the pointy waves - that is turn of the 20th century.

That may be an anomaly. According to Federico, you would be right in the age estimates.

I will say that the one with the pointy waves is probably from Mindanao.

[Sajen]

Originally Posted by Ian

I agree with your observations. Both are second half of 20th C, no earlier than 1960s and probably later.

Hello Ian,

I am as well agree like stated before that curved one is the later piece and as well with your time frame given but think that this gunongs where aluminium is used are from 1930-1950 as time frame, my three examples where aluminium was used for the fittings have all laminated and sturdy blades and also the use from bakelite (when it is bakelite) would confirm this.

Regards,
Detlef

[Marcus]

I was think mid-20th century.