Keris Buda

[rasjid]

G'day Alan,
The tang is square, and from my understanding this has core but laminated differently not sandwich like normally seen. The picture taken after warangan done and given oil on the blade.
The blade is dense and well packed, I like the material used.
Agreed Pajajaran or Tuban and the owner's family history has relationship with Mangkunegaran and lived in Kebumen.
Ok noted that the long gandhik as shown is probably not a "transitionall" keris KB.

"Is the top of the gonjo the correct shape for a KB?"
Could you elaborate more by what you mean?

Thank you.
Rasjid

[A. G. Maisey]

Rasjid

Have a look at image 12 for the gonjo.

http://www.kerisattosanaji.com/INTERPRETATIONPAGE3.html

Image 11 shows a keris that seems to be between a KB and a recognisably Modern Keris. The gonjo of this old waved keris is KB style, material conforms, but then we've got that long gandhik, and of course the waves. I've opted to call this "transitional", but we could equally call it "early Modern". Maybe the same line of thought could apply to your keris.

Yeah, based upon what you say, I think we could probably think of your keris as a transitional form, the square tang is possibly the decider, if you get that plus a few other things then its a bit hard to say that it is purely Modern in form.

You say the core is not a side to side core. Is it fitted like a "V", so that it only provides cutting edges?

Really Rasjid, in this whole area of KB's and very early keris, we're swimming in strange waters. To my knowledge nobody else has ever looked really closely at these questions. The whole time I've been studying keris the focus has been on art and to learn how to apply the tangguh system in a way that doesn't divorce you too much from the consensus of opinion. I've gone off to one side.

[rasjid]

Alan,

Thank you. I have very limited knowledge about Keris, especially never actually make one myself (from folding the material itself). For me to understand better about Keris itself we also need to understand how the keris is folded, the core and the pamor as well.
Back to my previous keris picture, I'm not 100% sure if its fitted like "V" or like Japanese sword or not. From what i can see, after the warangan - i can see the different material is used from that blade.

Mine also do not have the steel mendak, just plain square peksi.
Thanks

[A. G. Maisey]

Maybe the easiest way to gain an understanding of what happens when we fold and weld material is to duplicate the process with plasticine. I seem to recall Pauzan used this when he was working out how to weld ron duru.

I can understand what you mean when you say that different material is used for the core than for the blade, we can expect this, but what causes you to think that the core has been put into the blade in a manner that varies from the common side to side sandwich?

Re mendak, is that mendak ferric material? It looks like brass in the photo. Or maybe you have replaced the original ferric one with a brass one?

[rasjid]

Just my imagination, if the middle is the core ( different colour from other blade material surrounding it) the maker could sandwhich the core and Turn 45 degree before hammering so that the core in the middle. Straight through the peksi... and again I could be wrong

There is was old mendak attached when I received it but unusable anymore. I replace it with cirebonan handle and brass mendak as personal preference.

[A. G. Maisey]

When we put the core in, its just like making a sandwich, bottom layer of pamor, thin layer of steel, top layer of pamor. Then it gets welded in the forge. So, under normal circumstances and in this sort of keris, we could expect to see the core in the pesi running side to side , the same orientation as in the blade.

The way I understand what you told us, Rasjid, is that the line of the core does not continue through the pesi in the same orientation as it is in the blade, but rather it has been turned 45 degrees so that it now runs perpendicular to the blade surface.

If this is so, its a bit hard to understand why this would be done. In any case, its unusual. Can you see where the orientation of the core occurred? Can you see the core running through the top of the gonjo? Under microscopic examination, can you see any obvious joins in the blade or pesi?

I wonder if it is the result of a miscalculation in manufacture, and the smith made a virtue of necessity.

I cannot recall seeing a blade like this one. It appears to be Jawa, but an old Jawa blade with a kebo gandhik, KB tang, iron mendak---or probably more correctly metuk --- plus gonjo iras. Very peculiar. I think it is possible that at the time it was made the smith might have been struggling with the technique and this led to production of a rather unique blade.

I'd like to have a close look at this blade some day.

EDIT

I've just had another look at this blade pic. I can clearly see the core, or perhaps more correctly the cutting edge on the front of the blade,I cannot see an edge at the back of the blade, there may have been one that has been lost to erosion. I can also see a dark line running down the middle of the blade face. Is this maybe what you can see in the pesi? Not the core, but an attempt at a pamor pattern, or an accident in mixture of material?

[rasjid]

The blade is in Jakarta, you are always welcome to view it and in case you need to update yourself about Jakarta also.

I looked again the blade, may be you are right. Under proper sun light, the core is sandwich as normal, the middle line maybe an attempt as pamor or different type of material used (like sodo saler). The left darker colour is the core but none on the other side. The blade is welded tight and no visible joints.
I dont think any pamor here, just different material is being used and welded with the core.

thanks